Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

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Fox3WheresMyBanana
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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#161 Post by Fox3WheresMyBanana » Thu Jun 16, 2022 10:23 pm

I note the Green crowd have been yabbering on about PM2.5 particle emissions as justification for banning ICE cars and wood stoves (based on some pretty poor science to begin with).
It's just been determined that by far the biggest PM2.5 contributor is vehicle tires.
EVs are a lot heavier due to the batteries, so much more PM2.5 from tire wear.

As the Millwall crowd would say
"Oh, it's all gone quiet over there!"

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#162 Post by llondel » Thu Jun 16, 2022 10:31 pm

OFSO wrote:
Thu Jun 16, 2022 3:01 pm
Yeah, well I won't put the Ford up for sale just yet. Cars with stop/go have a battery life of 6 years (ish) and around 50K miles. The wife's 2004 Fiesta, not stop/go, mostly go, is on its third. Doesn't get driven much and winter temperatures are not good for the battery.
I had a 1999 Fiesta. The factory fit battery lasted until 2012.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#163 Post by G-CPTN » Fri Jun 17, 2022 3:11 am

CharlieOneSix wrote:
Thu Jun 16, 2022 10:13 pm
I'm told the list price for new EV6 orders went up by £2500 yesterday.
Is that because the subsidy has been withdrawn?

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#164 Post by CharlieOneSix » Fri Jun 17, 2022 8:41 am

G-CPTN wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 3:11 am
CharlieOneSix wrote:
Thu Jun 16, 2022 10:13 pm
I'm told the list price for new EV6 orders went up by £2500 yesterday.
Is that because the subsidy has been withdrawn?
No, the EV6 didn't qualify for the subsidy. The subsidy upper limit was a list price of £32000 and the EV6 costs more than that.
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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#165 Post by Woody » Fri Jun 17, 2022 8:55 am

Has yours been delivered yet?

Edit- just read your post on previous page :(
When all else fails, read the instructions.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#166 Post by ribrash » Fri Jun 17, 2022 9:45 am

llondel wrote:
Thu Jun 16, 2022 10:31 pm
OFSO wrote:
Thu Jun 16, 2022 3:01 pm
Yeah, well I won't put the Ford up for sale just yet. Cars with stop/go have a battery life of 6 years (ish) and around 50K miles. The wife's 2004 Fiesta, not stop/go, mostly go, is on its third. Doesn't get driven much and winter temperatures are not good for the battery.
I had a 1999 Fiesta. The factory fit battery lasted until 2012.
My 2008 Focus Titanium still has the original exhaust system.
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#167 Post by Wodrick » Fri Jun 17, 2022 9:55 am

So does our 2004 RAV4
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/ITORRO10?cm_ven=localwx_pwsdash

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#168 Post by Wodrick » Fri Jun 17, 2022 12:09 pm

But, on reflection, it's spent the last 13 years in a non-rusting environment.
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/ITORRO10?cm_ven=localwx_pwsdash

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#169 Post by Undried Plum » Fri Jun 17, 2022 6:20 pm

ExSp33db1rd wrote:
Sun Jun 12, 2022 6:02 pm
I guess I'm driving my last car, and I can drive from my home to Auckland and back, (should I ever be daft enough to want to ) with one 7 minute refuelling stop at my local, convenient, garage as I leave home, instead of multi, inconvenient, lengthy, stops to complete the round trip plus business mileage.

I've no idea what your distance to/from Auckland is, but I've never had a problem with proppa long distance driving in my EV. On a recent jaunt through Europe to NorthWest Norway we averaged six or seven hundred miles a day. Very happy not to have to spend 7 minutes clutching the pistol grip at a petrol station. Much nicer to go and have lunch or point Percy at the porcelain or stretch ones legs at some scenic location.

Nowadays more and more public charging stations deliver up to 200kW. My now somewhat slightly elderly car can take 140kW with ease, but not much more. A meal break usually takes longer than the charging does. Even a quickie loo break gives another hundred miles or more.

This week I drove from the bellybutton of Scotland to Upper Deeside to visit friends. 120 miles each way. I started with a full battery, thanks to the output of the pv array. I had no need to top up the battery with their charger, but did so anyway. They do the same thing when they visit us. I could easily have driven the whole round trip without recharging, but I was taught very early in my flying career that the only valid excuse for running out of fuel is visible bullet holes, so I'm very conservative with my energy planning on any kind of cross-coutry jaunt.

Today I drove past an old fashioned petrol station. The diesel price there is now £1.979/litre. I felt so sorry for the poor wretches on the forecourt dutifully clutching the grip of the delivery nozzle and staring in such a forlorn way at the digital price patch on the pump as their money was being hosed away. I guess that those sad sods just don't know about electric cars or don't understand arithmetic, or perhaps some ghastly combination of such ignorance(es).

I'm not at all surprised that the waiting list for EVs is now a year or more. Equally, I understand the oddity that secondhand EVs are now fetching higher prices than new list price equivalents. Bond salesmen and some other finance market salesmen call it 'backwardation'. It's a sure sign of a cocked up market.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#170 Post by Boac » Sat Jun 18, 2022 8:03 am

Plum wrote:I was taught very early in my flying career that the only valid excuse for running out of fuel is visible bullet holes
Plum - who was the misguided person who 'taught' you that and where? We are Interested in a bit more about your 'flying career'.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#171 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:40 am

isn't there a saying about the only time you have too much fuel is when you are in fire or the three most useless thing in aviation is among else fuel in the bowser?

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#172 Post by Undried Plum » Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:42 am

What has your ad hominem attack got to do with the topic, Mr BOAC? Silly or otherwise.

What do you want to know about electric cars?

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#173 Post by Boac » Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:45 am

You don't have to answer. You introduced the topic. Just leave us to guess.

About electric cars - why is the UK government scrapping the purchase incentive?

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#174 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:49 am

Undried Plum wrote:
Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:42 am
What has your ad hominem attack got to do with the topic Mr BOAC? Silly or otherwise.

What do you want to know about electric cars?
We have discussed before but I would only get it when I have full use of an electric car: the anxiety range particularly as there are in general fewer charging point than petrol stations and a serious traffic jam can create issues.

Still I like to see you answering BOAC's question.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#175 Post by Undried Plum » Sat Jun 18, 2022 11:02 am

Rwy in Sight wrote:
Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:40 am
isn't there a saying about the only time you have too much fuel is when you are in fire or the three most useless thing in aviation is among else fuel in the bowser?
Range anxiety is a thing of the past for EV drivers nowadays.

For us aviators, many of whom all of whom don't yet drive electric cars, there are three things to avoid: runway behind you; height above you; and fuel left on the ground.

For the drivers of electric cars, there are no such fears.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#176 Post by Undried Plum » Sat Jun 18, 2022 11:08 am

Rwy in Sight wrote:
Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:49 am

there are in general fewer charging point than petrol stations and a serious traffic jam can create issues.
Are you sure about that? Is that your experience?

In Britain and Northern Europe the opposite is true. I know that from personal observation.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#177 Post by Undried Plum » Sat Jun 18, 2022 11:31 am

Boac wrote:
Sat Jun 18, 2022 10:45 am
About electric cars - why is the UK government scrapping the purchase incentive?
Ask the government, not me.

I, personally, think that the the subsidy schemes, such as the FIT nonsense, were totally bonkers. Nevertheless, I took advantage and built my pv array; and what turned out to be a wonky windturbine, at the expense of others who pay horrendous amounts of tax.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#178 Post by Boac » Sat Jun 18, 2022 12:27 pm

Thinking about this, Plum, where do you see an 'ad hominem' attack? I asked about your misguided informant and your flying career. Hardly an attack on you, is it?

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#179 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:01 pm

UP I know plenty of gas stations around my place say about 10 Km but only a couple of charging spot one of which is really poorly designed.

How (would) you cope with an unxpected incident that blocks traffic in a cold night leadng to a rapidly decreasing power levvel with the closest charging spot being unavailable and the next one beyond the car's endurance? During an unforcasted snow storm for instance.

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Re: Electric Cars II - Not Silly!

#180 Post by VP959 » Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:13 pm

In the UK there are currently over 32,000 EV chargers available, and around 8,378 filling stations. Not sure how that compares with other countries. We still have a few places where chargers are a bit sparse, notably mid-Wales, but in several years of EV driving I've yet to have any problems at all with being able to charge. The whole charging thing seems very poorly understood by those that haven't actually experienced EV ownership. There seems to be an assumption that EVs need the equivalent of filling stations to charge, whereas the reality is that the vast majority of charging is done when the car is parked for some other reason. It's pretty rare for me to need to stop and charge on route to somewhere, probably only done it maybe a dozen times in all the years I've been driving an EV.

Take this year, for example. In the ~4,000 miles I've driven so far I've used public chargers twice. Once was on route somewhere where I stopped for 20 minutes for a break and decided to top up at the same time, once was a day trip to Bletchley Park where I took advantage of the charge points in their car park to charge whilst we spent most of the day there. The rest of the time I either charged overnight at home, or on a few occasions overnight at hotels we were staying at.

My wife's had an EV for a bit over a year now and her experience is much the same, although she does more long trips than me, when going to see her mother. They entail a stop for charging on the way down, to give her enough to drive around down there and get back. She usually stops at a farm shop/cafe where they have a couple of rapid chargers and has a break for half an hour whilst the car tops up. She'd stop there for half an hour or so anyway, unlike me she can't drive for a couple of hundred miles without needing to stop for a break.

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