EASA clears Max for flight.

[TheGreenGoblin]

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/16/boeing- ... -easa.html

Europe’s aviation regulator has declared Boeing’s 737 Max aircraft safe to fly after it was grounded in March 2019 following two accidents that left 346 people dead.

Patrick Ky, executive director of the European Union Aviation Safety Agency, told Bloomberg Friday that he’s satisfied with the changes Boeing has made to the aircraft, adding that the aircraft could return to the region’s skies before the end of 2020.

The announcement comes even though Boeing is yet to implement a software upgrade that his agency demanded. It could be two years before it’s ready

[G-CPTN]

Now we wait for the airlines to decide whether they are ready to fly them.

[PHXPhlyer]

And then we wait for the airline passengers to decide whether they are ready to fly on them.

PP

Edit:
American has announced that will prominently show that a flight is on a Max.

[Rwy in Sight]

And then we wait for the airline passengers to decide whether they are ready to fly on them.

PP

Just drop the price low enough (COVID issues excluded) and they will fly. I am curious to know how many passengers still remember the MAX.

[PHXPhlyer]

What's a Max?
737-8

PP

[Ex-Ascot]

Not getting on one for a good few years.

[TheGreenGoblin]

We should never forget that the 737 Max is still fundamentally unstable, being a stretched version of Boeing's workhorse 737-700 that uses almost the same fuselage design as the 737 800 but adds larger, more fuel-efficient engines that are closer to the front of the plane to avert ground clearance issues and the whole thrust line of the aircraft is still likely to cause excessive pitch in high throttle/AoA situations (i.e. the aircraft is still fundamentally unstable). Flyable only due to the the AoA sensor kludge and additional redundancy and some tinkering with the software.

Maybe instability is good for fighter aircraft that are dynamically computer controlled but the 737 is neither.

Tis a 737 design that has been pushed beyond its limits. Is it safe? Hmmh....

[Rwy in Sight]

Ex-A I am not sure when we will be able to fly in general again (as pax). I wouldn't mind to fly on one if it fits my schedule although I doubt many airlines would take them right now.

TGG, I have minimal knowledge of aerodynamics but I think maybe the 737-8/9/10 or MAX is unstable but it might function like my idea of flying the very next day on an airliner that has recently had a crash. Crews are extra cautions and more concentrated on that phase of flight. I am sure the crews will be absolutely concentrated when the conditions for an Ethiopia type of crash are lining up. Plus I feel that there has been enough media exposure to make it right or Boeing going under.

[TheGreenGoblin]

Ex-A I am not sure when we will be able to fly in general again (as pax). I wouldn't mind to fly on one if it fits my schedule although I doubt many airlines would take them right now.

TGG, I have minimal knowledge of aerodynamics but I think maybe the 737-8/9/10 or MAX is unstable but it might function like my idea of flying the very next day on an airliner that has recently had a crash. Crews are extra cautions and more concentrated on that phase of flight. I am sure the crews will be absolutely concentrated when the conditions for an Ethiopia type of crash are lining up. Plus I feel that there has been enough media exposure to make it right or Boeing going under.

RiS ideally an airliner will be longitudinally statically stable although the trend over the years has been to relax this requirement somewhat in order to allow aft centre of gravity loading in the ever increasing quest for fuel efficiency but the Max in certain flight regimes takes the concept of elastic longitudinal stability beyond safe margins. The aircraft is essentially unstable. Sure pilots will be watching this aircraft like a hawk but it is a sub-optimal situation to be in.

[G-CPTN]

the Max in certain flight regimes takes the concept of elastic longitudinal stability beyond safe margins. The aircraft is essentially unstable. Sure pilots will be watching this aircraft like a hawk but it is a sub-optimal situation to be in.

The elephant in the cockpit?

[Ex-Ascot]

Ex-A I am not sure when we will be able to fly in general again (as pax). I wouldn't mind to fly on one if it fits my schedule although I doubt many airlines would take them right now.

TGG, I have minimal knowledge of aerodynamics but I think maybe the 737-8/9/10 or MAX is unstable but it might function like my idea of flying the very next day on an airliner that has recently had a crash. Crews are extra cautions and more concentrated on that phase of flight. I am sure the crews will be absolutely concentrated when the conditions for an Ethiopia type of crash are lining up. Plus I feel that there has been enough media exposure to make it right or Boeing going under.

OK, off you go then mate. Kalo Taxithi.

Crews are extra cautions and more concentrated on that phase of flight.

Depends on the training and the airline. The whole point of this design was so that the crews could just jump in it and fly it like any old 737 without any conversion training. The pilot's notes didn't even mention extra bells and whistles. Let alone what to do if it decided to throw itself at the ground.

[barkingmad]

What has the USA and/or Mr Boeing promised to the EUSSR to cause such a rapid change of heart, something unknown in the Brussels Bureaucracy recently?

And will the newly powerful UK CAA, risen from the ashes like a Phoenix, happily certify the same aircraft or will they willy-wave and demand extra flight-testing with more mods?

[Rwy in Sight]

OK, off you go then mate. Kalo Taxithi.

Ex-A thanks but it is a long way before I undertake any travelling.

You are also right about the updated training and the need to carefully choose the airline. I stick with EU airlines, US, Canadian or British. I have not followed the certification closely so does it involved any additional training or aircraft system modifications? Because I seem to remember about a clause where Boeing has to pay a sum of money to Southwest if additional training was required.

TGG, I agree about being a sub-optimal situation for the MAX.

[Undried Plum]

I greatly hope that none of the underwriters at Lloyds are risking any of my FaL on those **** things.

The next Boeing 737 splash is going to be very VERY expensive.

[TheGreenGoblin]

I greatly hope that none of the underwriters at Lloyds are risking any of my FaL on those **** things.

The next Boeing 737 splash is going to be very VERY expensive.

Sadly, statistics say it will happen...

[Boac]

What is it they say about kitchens and heat..................?

[TheGreenGoblin]

What is it they say about kitchens and heat..................?

Don't want poor old UP ending up like old James Hunt, with his Mercedes Benz up on bricks because he couldn't pay for the road tax and insurance after the syndicates had taken him to the cleaners...

[Boac]

Indeed, but always a good idea to have a door you can use to get out of a hot kitchen. Let's hope UP has had as much fun on the way as the Hunt.

[ian16th]

Ain't ever going to get me on one!

I'd rather get into a helicopter.

[Boac]

Even a Mexican navy one? https://t.co/57RKfnGizw?amp=1