Oh dear - red faces as well?

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#201 Post by Boac » Tue Nov 22, 2022 2:22 pm

From where I sit, the whole team, from top to bottom (no pun intended...) has brought this pile of poop onto its own head. I am very unhappy. I see also from the Mail article that "A further five male officers have been disciplined internally by the RAF based on the claims made by Red Arrows team members, many of whom were junior and inexperienced female personnel." Since we know only of 2..........?? If they are pilots, that makes just about the whole team! Red 1 - what were you failing to do? I shudder to think of Montenegro sitting in charge of disciplinary issues!

Although the team can function perfectly under the leader, without the 'top cover' of the O/C Red Arrows, at this important time on a major tour of the ME I doubt that Red1 (and the rest of the team) can stay sufficiently focussed on important bits and reluctantly I join the call for a return to UK and a 'shut down' for however long is necessary.

I never thought I would ever write that!

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#202 Post by Pontius Navigator » Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:57 pm

The Reds still use the Hawk T1 whereas training is now done with the T2. Some years ago there was a question about availability of the T1 and provision of the T2. This could be the chance for naysayers to get a capability holiday.

One question is what is the acrobatic team for. The RAF continues to shrink and there is little shortage of applicants for pilot seats. Lots of displays by this obsolescence trainer are flown overseas, why?

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#203 Post by Boac » Tue Nov 22, 2022 5:46 pm

Lots of displays by this obsolescence trainer are flown overseas, why?
A 'multiple' question!
1) In a typical year (of old) the team would fly somewhere around 120 or so PUBLIC displays. Shoreham plus other issues have significantly reduced that number.
2) Promotion of the UK and sales of UK military equipment NEEDS to happen abroad and it is reckoned the 'proceeds' more than cover the cost of the team.

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#204 Post by k3k3 » Tue Nov 22, 2022 6:49 pm

Is "Operational Grounds" a euphemism for half of the team being fired?

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#205 Post by 4mastacker » Tue Nov 22, 2022 7:08 pm

Ex-Ascot wrote:
Tue Nov 22, 2022 12:16 pm
.............I still wonder if all this fuss would have been made if it was just a front line Squadron not the display team. For goodness sake the things that went on which were swept under the carpet. I am sure that we can all recall a few.
Mrs 4ma commented that in all the time she was in the WRAF, she never had a problem when she was very much in a role which involved working closely with the crews. If they tried it on, they never asked her to make their coffee again. :)) :)) ;)))
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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#206 Post by Ex-Ascot » Wed Nov 23, 2022 5:25 am

As Flt Cdr Ops all the cabin crew (200) came under my command. Can't remember how many girlies but nearly half. Never had a problem, that was brought to my attention. I was aware of an affair between a married MALM and a Cpl but I think most of the Sqn knew. Didn't affect operational efficiency. In fact for some reason the plods became involved with that. I protected my chap.
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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#207 Post by Ex-Ascot » Sat Nov 26, 2022 1:25 pm

As I suspected. One ringleader woman stirring up the *****.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... false.html
'Yes, Madam, I am drunk, but in the morning I shall be sober and you will still be ugly.' Sir Winston Churchill.

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#208 Post by Boac » Sat Nov 26, 2022 9:00 pm

If that article is correct, then there should be some commissions terminated quite a bit higher up the tree.

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#209 Post by Ex-Ascot » Sun Nov 27, 2022 7:34 am

Amd another one.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ander.html

Love the last bit.
Last year, a book charting the glamorous, glorious history of the Red Arrows became a bestseller. It may now need an update – but that is problematic. Its author? Wing Commander David Montenegro...
'Yes, Madam, I am drunk, but in the morning I shall be sober and you will still be ugly.' Sir Winston Churchill.

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#210 Post by Boac » Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:56 am

"Forty-three personnel," complaining about it all - that's is one hell of a percentage of the team. Tragic.

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#211 Post by TheGreenAnger » Sun Nov 27, 2022 11:28 am

A total failure of leadership, and this probably extends way up the slimy seniority pole, to well above Montenegro's level.
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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#212 Post by 4mastacker » Sun Nov 27, 2022 7:12 pm

Quote lifted from a recent post on TOP:
The Reds exclusive, private flying club has closed down.

Based at RAF Waddington, RAFAT should benefit from integrating back into their parent organisation.
Almost repeats the words of AOC 1 Group when he announced to the assembled masses in Scampton's cinema that they were being moved from Kemble to Scampton in order "to bring them back into the Royal Air Force".
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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#213 Post by Boac » Sun Nov 27, 2022 7:34 pm

Hmm. That seems to have worked well, doesn't it?

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Re: Oh dear - red faces as well?

#214 Post by Boac » Sun Dec 04, 2022 8:44 pm

Well, the team is on its way back from the ME via Cyprus. Soon back at Waddo with wives and loved ones. Let's hope they never meet up =))

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