Death of senior Royal Marine officer (aged 54)

[G-CPTN]

Why did the Captain wait until the last second to "save" the aircraft?
Did he feel outranked, in some way, when it was so abundantly clear for many tens of seconds that the aircraft was nothing like near to a stabilised approach on an approach to a rain-soaked runway with a known tailwind?

Perhaps he saw a means of ending HRH's flying career?

[Ex-Ascot]

Sorry UP I can't comment. I would tell you over a beer or scotch. Anyway G-CPTN, yes HRH didn't fly again after that apart from as passenger and gave his personal Captain embossed silver cuff-links upon his retirement.

His Captain flew the body of HRH The Princess of Wales back from frog land with HRH PC on board. For the record Mrs Ex-Ascot was local controller at NHT who gave the clearance to land.

[Undried Plum]

they both retired at their normal retirement dates.

Ho hum.

And so it goes on.

Nothing to see here. Move along.

[TheGreenGoblin]

PS
I greatly wish that he'd had the benefit of having had my two wonderful godfathers: Donald and Hugh. Their tutorship, either one of them, would have seen him through whatever personal crisis it was was that broke through the membrane that he thought should protect him.


RIP: Donald Caskie and Hugh de Wet.

Hugh Oloff de Wet, son of Captain Thomas De Wet, Royal Navy Officer and reputed to be a relative of Boer General Christiaan de Wet.

The de Wets in South Africa

Hugh Oloff De Wet.JPG (33.8 KiB) Viewed 824 times

De Wet he is mounted, he rides up the street
The English skedaddle an A1 retreat!
And the commander swore: They've got through the net
That's been spread with such care for Christiaan De Wet.

There are hills beyond Winburg and Boers on each hill
Sufficient to thwart ten generals' skill
There are stout-hearted burghers 10,000 men set
On following the Mausers of Christian De Wet.

Then away to the hills, to the veld, to the rocks
Ere we own a usurper we'll crouch with the fox
And tremble false Jingoes amidst all your glee
Ye have not seen the last of my Mausers and me!

[TheGreenGoblin]

Hugh de Wet's lineage.

[FD2]

UP - Your son did well to achieve his 'majority' as they call it - that would rank as a lt col when embarked. It was the achievement dreamt about by the two young RM lieutenants on the junior staff course I attended. One went off to the SBS and no doubt did lots of interesting things in 1982. The other had married a gp captain's daughter and also did well. They were both bad news for my mess bill and liver but great company.

41 Commando we embarked from Malta for assault exercises pretty well filled Hermes and on the whole were good to meet apart from two or three nutters. 45 Commando we embarked from Arbroath for the Arctic Warfare training in a very wintery Norway seemed a more stable bunch.

The fawning over the 'German' family and honorary ranking will continue for as long as the UK is a monarchy. Some of the arse kissing of minor royals really annoyed me but that's the present system. On the pruning issue I fully agree with Prince Charles, especially if it might downgrade Andrew.

Some of them have let the system and their family down over the last few years but any officer below 'flag' rank would find it terminal to his career to refuse the future king a landing even when the chap was a sort of trainee co-pilot to the captain of the aircraft. Some pretty fast decision making to be made in the last seconds of that landing I suspect. I think you could forgive those concerned by now UP - worse things happen at sea and it's not worth getting liverish about all these years later.

I think Princess Anne would be a very suitable replacement for the ginger donkey in Hollywood - she's no-nonsense, dedicated and unlikely to flounce off to anywhere - and I think Kate would be a very popular choice in a few year's time - the next few years are likely to be rather busy for her, for obvious reasons. She also seems to have the 'right stuff'.

C16 - I suspect Jerry Kyd will be off to a well deserved retirement on age grounds, but Radakin has been First Sea Lord since 2019 so will be due for replacement soon and Kyd is a year younger. I know he'd be a popular replacement as 1SL. I think there will be a lot of talking going on between the Board and Defence ministers at the moment.

[Undried Plum]

Hugh Oloff De Wet.

That's my other 'uncle' Hugh.

A remarkable man. He taught me so much when I was a young boy.

I did not appreciate what he was teaching me at the time, but when I was in prison in Audi Sarabia his strength, and that of my other non-biologicical 'uncle' Donald, swept me through what would have been bloody hard on anyone who had not had the immense benefit of those educations.

I only knew him as a Czech. I never knew him to have been a Zarth Effrigan.

To this day and beyond, I cannot bear to kill a housefly. They all are descendants of the only friend he had in his prison cell, in my mind.

In my 10' x 10' x 10' concrete cell in Dammam I longed to have such a friend. In a tiny way, a tiny little part of me is still in that prison cell, and perhaps an even smaller part of me may virtually be in Hugh's cell too.

Oddly, I never made a mental or spiritual connect between Hugh and Donald. They were different people, but had a connection which I did not connect until my second or third month of my imprisonment.

Donald was religious. Hugh, not so much.

Hugh's experience diminished his belief in a beneficent god. Donald's otherwise comparable experience strengthened his.

Each of them, totally separately, had prepared me for what I went through in those dark days. I never glimpsed what they went through, no torture other than eighty lashes, but those two guys gave me the mental and moral strength (they are different strengths) to go through each day, day by day, and to come out at the other end with nothing more than very rare bad dreams which put me back into my cell or Hugh's or Donald's.

To get back onto topic in this ramble:- I have no respect for what the Marine chose as a course of action.

[Undried Plum]

HRH didn't fly again after that apart from as passenger and gave his personal Captain embossed silver cuff-links upon his retirement.

Yup. That's the way it works.

Bury all three landingthingies in peat: get rewarded for responsibility.

Or in case of the prat connected to the pedals and hand thingies, hand over responsibility to the flunky who signed the 700.

£3M. No career damaged.

[Undried Plum]

UP - Your son did well to achieve his 'majority' as they call it - that would rank as a lt col when embarked. It was the achievement dreamt about by the two young RM lieutenants on the junior staff course I attended. One went off to the SBS and no doubt did lots of interesting things in 1982. The other had married a gp captain's daughter and also did well. They were both bad news for my mess bill and liver but great company.

Me boy did well. He always buys the first and last rounds, and many in between. Good on 'im.


Greatly to my regret, he never tells war stories, though when he speaks Arabic to me, as he quite often does to piss his mother off, I could tell where he'd been 'operating'. Omani dialect is very noticeably different from Meghrabi and from Levantine and yet greater from classical Arabic. He didn't even have to wink to tell me where he'd got his suntan from. It sure as hell wasn't from darkest Dorsetshire.

I think Princess Anne would be a very suitable replacement for the ginger donkey in Hollywood.

Neigh!

If it doesn't eat hay and doesn't fart, she ain't interested. That was her own German father's assessment of that filly.

[TheGreenGoblin]

Hugh Oloff De Wet.

That's my other 'uncle' Hugh.

A remarkable man. He taught me so much when I was a young boy.

I did not appreciate what he was teaching me at the time, but when I was in prison in Audi Sarabia his strength, and that of my other non-biologicical 'uncle' Donald, swept me through what would have been bloody hard on anyone who had not had the immense benefit of those educations.

I only knew him as a Czech. I never knew him to have been a Zarth Effrigan.

To this day and beyond, I cannot bear to kill a housefly. They all are descendants of the only friend he had in his prison cell, in my mind.

In my 10' x 10' x 10' concrete cell in Dammam I longed to have such a friend. In a tiny way, a tiny little part of me is still in that prison cell, and perhaps an even smaller part of me may virtually be in Hugh's cell too.

Oddly, I never made a mental or spiritual connect between Hugh and Donald. They were different people, but had a connection which I did not connect until my second or third month of my imprisonment.

Donald was religious. Hugh, not so much.

Hugh's experience diminished his belief in a beneficent god. Donald's otherwise comparable experience strengthened his.

Each of them, totally separately, had prepared me for what I went through in those dark days. I never glimpsed what they went through, no torture other than eighty lashes, but those two guys gave me the mental and moral strength (they are different strengths) to go through each day, day by day, and to come out at the other end with nothing more than very rare bad dreams which put me back into my cell or Hugh's or Donald's.

To get back onto topic in this ramble:- I have no respect for what the Marine chose as a course of action.

Not Czech, but English by birth, with South African ancestry. As you know, he spent a lot of time in a Nazi prison in Czechoslovakia after having been arrested as a spy. He had been working for the French intelligence service after his time as a mercenary pilot in Spain, fighting against Franco's forces. As you will also know, he had been drummed out of the RAF for insubordination earlier in his very colourful career, that included having to be smuggled out Ethiopa by the British embassy, after having been embroiled in the threat of a dual with a Belgian officer he had insulted, who would most certainly would have killed him, as the Belgian was a master swordsman, de Wet not so much. De Wet's Russian wife, who had also been arrested by the Germans, later committed suicide in prison. My old UCT friend Sam Sole's father, Donald, who was a young, very juniour South African diplomat in London, during the early days of the war, was approached by the US embassy in London, the USA was not at war with Germany at the time, to say that the US embassy in Germany had heard that a certain "Justus" De Wet was being held, condemned to death by the Nazis in Czechoslovakia, and that the US believed that he might be South African. Donald didn't know Hugh from Adam, but saved his life by claiming that this "Justus" person was related to the famous Boer General, Christiaan de Wet, and let it be known, that should he be executed, it could alienate pro-German Afrikaners. The Germans were fed this information, and thus they kept him alive in prison, but continued to torture him, smashing all his fingers, and ensuring, that when he woke every morning, he would hear them executing other people outside the window of his cell, never knowing when his time would come, keeping him believing he was on death row, a terrible form of mental torture. When the Nazi regime collapsed in Czechoslovakia, he managed to escape, luckily for him, as the Nazis were very likely to have killed him, out of spite, at that stage. He was then picked up by the US forces, who at first believed he was a Nazi, but checked out his credentials and story and eventually reptriated him back to the UK.

Hugh owed his life to Donald Bell Sole, who went on to become South African Ambassador to the US, based in New York up until 1982, and I got to know his son, Sam, an ex SACS boy, at UCT. Sam is now a fearless, very well known investigative journalist in South Africa.

[TheGreenGoblin]

Sorry to the OP for the thread drift.

[FD2]

C16 - Here seems to be the answer. Radakin is the first naval man to be CDS since 2001 and Key will apparently move up to be CNS/1SL. He will be 57/58 at the end of that appointment. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/1 ... ed-forces/

Exclusive: Navy chief Tony Radakin to be next head of the Armed Forces

First Sea Lord is the first Navy officer to be appointed head of Britain's military since 2001
By Danielle Sheridan, Political and Defence Correspondent 6 October 2021 • 10:59pm


The First Sea Lord and Chief of the Naval Staff has been selected by the Prime Minister as the next head of the Armed Forces, The Telegraph can reveal.

Admiral Sir Tony Radakin will take over from General Sir Nick Carter as Chief of the Defence Staff, making him the first military chief to come from the Navy since Admiral Sir Michael Boyce in 2001.

Sources close to General Sir Patrick Sanders, who was seen as the First Sea Lord’s biggest threat to securing the role and believed to be the Ministry of Defence’s recommendation for the position, confirmed he had not been successful in the race.

They added that he was “relaxed” about the decision.

Downing Street is expected on Thursday to formally announce Boris Johnson's choice of defence chief.

It is understood that Vice-Admiral Sir Ben Key, who led the Afghanistan evacuation and is in charge of all overseas military operations, will be promoted to Admiral and replace Sir Tony as First Sea Lord.

The contest for the new head of the Armed Forces has long been considered a two-horse race between Sir Tony, for his knowledge of the seas and Sir Patrick, owing to his deep understanding of how to integrate cyber capabilities into the Armed Forces.

However, others in the mix to clinch the post included General Sir Mark Carleton-Smith, the former head of Britain’s special forces and a personal friend of Mr Johnson.

Under Sir Tony, the UK has seen two new aircraft carriers brought into service. He also oversaw the deployment of one, HMS Queen Elizabeth, including escort ships and a hunter-killer submarine, to the Indo-Pacific region. As a result the Royal Navy is seen as embodying the Government’s Global Britain agenda.

Meanwhile sources have said that the recent Aukus deal with the US and Australia over the future provision of nuclear submarine capability reflected well on the First Sea Lord.

Earlier this year The Telegraph revealed that Sir Nick, 62, who was in his third year as Chief of the Defence Staff and was due to retire, would remain in post until the end of the year so that he could lead the transformation of the military following the Integrated Defence Review.

If true, the brush with Major General Holmes' suicide doesn't seem to have harmed his career. Why do I feel Boris is seldom likely to make the right decision on this or any matter, come to think of it, which doesn't mean Radakin's not the man for the job.

Drifting a little to Manchester, Boris' 'keynote' speech to (the) conference seems to have struck the wrong notes - described as more like a continuous waffle. Now he's promising no building on greenfield sites and a low tax high wage economy. Was that a pig flying past my window?

[Pontius Navigator]

embossed silver cuff-links upon.....

I have a pair of embossed silver cufflinks too.

My first sqn was different from others. You bought your tankard on arrival, aka Fox Pot whose handle was a Fox after the Sqn crest. During your tour you contributed to the silver fund. On departure you got the engraved cuff links with a Fox head on each link.

[Pontius Navigator]

Just found out I was related to him in a way.

[FD2]

Related to Radakin? Are your folks from 'Up North' too? That cheered me up when I read he was from Oldham - where my maternal great granny was born.

Or are you related to Major General Holmes family?

[Pontius Navigator]

The latter on his wife's side.

[FD2]

She must be feeling pretty bad now. The reason(s) for what happened might come out at the inquest so no use in speculating.

[Pontius Navigator]

FD2, my daughter experienced that. Ex-pilot had an argument with his wife. Last words to the effect "l'll show you. ". It's though he hadn't really meant to....

She is in her 40s, no children, and suddenly that. Amongst other things she could not unlock his phone or laptop. Fortunately two of our cousins are forensic analysis, one specialist in telephones and the other in computers.

That is the sort of problem that a sudden death can bring besides all the emotional trauma.

Lea is the same age as he was.

[ExSp33db1rd]

There was an obsession, which started back about the 1970s, for officers in all the branches of the UK armed forces to have a degree of some sort - not just the technical specialisations. I don't think it mattered whether it was in Law or Horticulture but it was thought to be essential to produce the sort of trained and trainable brains the Forces needed. I don't know how they managed to accomplish anything before then! Two mediocre 'A' Levels was all I brought to the table so that may prove their point!

School Cert. - albeit with 7 passes in 9 subjects - and a Fail in French was what I offered. Subsequently told by a Flt. Eng. that I only needed one phrase in any language anyway, to wit - " Two beers please, my friend will pay " - Saw me through my career.

[TheGreenGoblin]

Army plans huge cuts to its infantry that could see up to a third of troops axed as critics fear UK won't be able to fight lengthy wars like in Iraq
Army will make cuts to infantry, with smaller forces going on shorter missions, critics fear the move will leave the UK unable to fight long military campaigns, it will be overseen by new Chief of the Defence Staff, Admiral Sir Tony Radakin

The Rifles Regiment is set to lose more than 900 troops, falling to 1,600 by 2025

The Army is to make huge cuts to its infantry – its main body of fighting troops – in a move that critics fear will leave the UK unable to fight lengthy military campaigns.

Reductions in personnel will see the military send smaller-sized forces on shorter missions, rather than bigger and longer deployments such as Iraq and Afghanistan.

The controversial move will be overseen by the new Chief of the Defence Staff, Admiral Sir Tony Radakin.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -axed.html

The man has exactly the slippery credentials required to work in the financial services industry or politics.

Compare this feeble prawn to military leaders like Zhukov, Paton or any one of the historically great British military leaders and throw him back in his slimy bucket. He doesn't even deserve the mercy of a shot behind the head with a Makarov pistol!