?? Lost the plot again. What was?PN wrote:Dramatic hype by the production team.
Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Ah well, we'll never know.
I wait with bated breath the next instalment of Captain Pugwash. I guess we lack any RN 'Seamen Staines' experience on this site and have 'only' retired 'airy fairies', but I becoming more and more alarmed at what I see on arrrse about our glorious navy. Apparently the protective casing of a T23 forward gun is made of fibreglass and will only withstand heavy seas from forward without taking 'damage'.
Surely this is a bit of a problem for the Gunnery Occifer when he is trying to fire at anything off the bow? Does he need to point the whole ship at the target?
There is also talk on arrse of a major 'fudging' of the sonar array incident.
Popcorn and a beer at the ready for 21:00(Z), C5, Monday.
I wait with bated breath the next instalment of Captain Pugwash. I guess we lack any RN 'Seamen Staines' experience on this site and have 'only' retired 'airy fairies', but I becoming more and more alarmed at what I see on arrrse about our glorious navy. Apparently the protective casing of a T23 forward gun is made of fibreglass and will only withstand heavy seas from forward without taking 'damage'.
Surely this is a bit of a problem for the Gunnery Occifer when he is trying to fire at anything off the bow? Does he need to point the whole ship at the target?
There is also talk on arrse of a major 'fudging' of the sonar array incident.
Popcorn and a beer at the ready for 21:00(Z), C5, Monday.
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Was that from aarse? Does that mean that 'heavy seas' are only 'safe' when arriving directly from the direction which the turret is facing rather than from sideways when the turret is trained to port or starboard? Is it a goffer arriving at the turret from the side which causes it to leak? As I already pointed out, the Type 23s have been in service since 1989 so is it likely that a defect like that will have been tolerated for so long? Was the 'leak' so serious it was flooding the magazine space? If there was a defect in this particular ship's turret then I hardly think the crew can be blamed, if the ship hasn't been in harbour to fix it. It would be like blaming the Crabs RAF for some fault which occurred in an aircraft they were flying in at the time, but I'm sure Channel 5 is telling the unvarnished truth, with no 'dramatic hype' as PN has kindly pointed out.
'Factual' TV programmes eh? Who can believe them?BTW Is there an aft gun as well? I thought that space was taken up by the flight deck.
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Best ask Seaman Staines, but I assumed there was probably other armament on the ship, like anti-aircraft or GMP type stuff? Are you saying all she has is 2 x 4.5s that actually go bang?BTW Is there an aft gun as well?
Regarding arrse, the word is that any heavy sea on the side of the plastic will damage it.
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Maybe some pictures will help to clarify what we are discussing.
The single barrelled (not double barrelled) Mk 8 un-manned automatic turret going bang! and a 4.5" shell flying away:
The pointy end, showing the turret in question, missile silos and tubes. The dark bit at the breech end of the barrel is the casing in question which has been such a danger to the Type 23 since 1989. It allows the gun barrel to be elevated and depressed while shielding the innards from the weather, but not according to Channel 5. It's a wonder none of them have sunk due to this fault.
Firing a torpedo:
The single barrelled (not double barrelled) Mk 8 un-manned automatic turret going bang! and a 4.5" shell flying away:
The pointy end, showing the turret in question, missile silos and tubes. The dark bit at the breech end of the barrel is the casing in question which has been such a danger to the Type 23 since 1989. It allows the gun barrel to be elevated and depressed while shielding the innards from the weather, but not according to Channel 5. It's a wonder none of them have sunk due to this fault.
- Type 23 pointy end.png (751.77 KiB) Viewed 469 times
Firing a torpedo:
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Here is a general view of a Type 23. I left the RN in 1977 - 12 years before the first of these ships was commissioned. I can't say what all of the equipment in these ships is as I don't have a stick of RN rock up my backside but I hope I know what websites and documentaries I can trust and those I would view with a large spoonful of salt.
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Great pics, FD. To the untrained eye it doesn't look like any smaller armament.
More to come 'morra as I said.
More to come 'morra as I said.
-
Pontius Navigator
- Chief Pilot
- Posts: 14669
- Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:17 am
- Location: Gravity be the clue
- Gender:
- Age: 80
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Picture 2, abeam the bridge, starboard side with white foam backdrop and portside above black area you can make out machine guns.
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Type 23 frigate
Edited for size,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_23_frigate
The Type 23 frigate or Duke class is a class of frigates built for the United Kingdom's Royal Navy. The ships are named after British Dukes, thus leading to the class being commonly known as the Duke class. The first Type 23, HMS Norfolk, was commissioned in 1989, and the sixteenth, HMS St Albans was commissioned in June 2002. They form the core of the Royal Navy's destroyer and frigate fleet and serve alongside the Type 45 destroyers. They were designed for anti-submarine warfare, but have been used for a range of uses.[4] Twelve Type 23 frigates remain in service with the Royal Navy, with three vessels having been sold to the Chilean Navy, and one being retired in 2021.
The Royal Navy's Type 23 frigates will be replaced by the Type 26 Global Combat Ship and the Type 31 frigate.[5] As of 2021 it is anticipated that HMS St Albans will be the last to retire from the Royal Navy, in 2035.[3][6]
The ship was designed by the Royal Corps of Naval Constructors, in close partnership with the prime contractor, Yarrow Shipbuilders.[8] No anti-air warfare system was planned, however the lessons learned during the Falklands War led to the introduction of the vertically launched Sea Wolf missile; In June 1984 BAe Dynamics was awarded a development contract for the missile system.[9][10] Unlike conventional Sea Wolf, the missile is boosted vertically until it clears the ship's superstructure, and then turns to fly directly to the target. Consequently, the ship's structure does not impose no-fire directions that would delay or inhibit missile firing in a conventionally launched system. With the addition of Harpoon surface-to-surface missiles and a medium calibre gun for naval gunfire support, the Type 23 had evolved into a more complex and balanced vessel optimised for general warfare, which introduced a host of new technologies and concepts to the Royal Navy. These included extensive radar cross-section reduction design measures, automation to substantially reduce crew size, a combined diesel-electric and gas (CODLAG) propulsion system providing very quiet running for anti-submarine operations and a large range.[11]
Upgrades and future technologies
The Type 23's propeller is specially designed to reduce underwater noise during anti-submarine operations.
Type 997 Artisan 3D radar on HMS Argyll following her 2010 refit
Mid-life refit
The class underwent[when?] mid-life refits which lasted 12–18 months and cost £15-20m. Aside from refurbishment of the mess decks and drive train, the ships are being fitted with a transom flap which can add up to one knot (1.9 km/h; 1.2 mph) to the top speed[21] and reduce fuel consumption by 13%, and Intersleek anti-fouling paint which added two knots (3.7 km/h; 2.3 mph) to the top speed of Ark Royal.[22] Although the top speed of the Duke class is commonly quoted as 28 knots, the caption of an official Navy photo suggests that Lancaster was capable of 32 knots even before her mid-life refit.[23][24] The Sea Wolf Mid Life Update (SWMLU) improves the sensors and guidance of the missiles, point defences are further improved with new remotely operated 30 mm guns, and Mod 1 of the Mk8 main gun has an all-electric loading system and a smaller radar cross-section. The communications and command systems are also upgraded.
A further Life Extension (LIFEX) Upkeep project saw the Sea Wolf missiles with the new Sea Ceptor anti-air defence missiles;[25] these were first test-fired from HMS Argyll on 4 September 2017.[26]
Sonar 2087
Further information: Sonar 2087
Sonar 2087 is described by its manufacturer as "a towed-array system that enables Type 23 frigates to hunt the latest submarines at considerable distances and locate them beyond the range at which they [submarines] can launch an attack."[27] Sonar 2087 was fitted to eight Type 23 frigates in mid-life refits between 2004 and 2012; the five oldest Type 23 frigates, HMS Montrose, Monmouth, Iron Duke, Lancaster and Argyll are not scheduled to receive Sonar 2087. These ships will instead continue to be employed across the normal range of standing Royal Navy deployments. The Chilean Navy is procuring a number of Sonar 2087 towed arrays from Thales Underwater Systems to equip its multipurpose frigates.[28]
Artisan 3D radar
Main article: Type 997 Artisan radar
The Type 23's original medium-range radar was replaced by BAE Systems Type 997 Artisan 3D radar; the project was worth £100 million and the contract was announced on 4 August 2008.[29] It is a medium-range radar designed to be capable of operating effectively in littoral zones and improving air-defence, anti-surface (anti-ship) and air traffic management capabilities of the Type 23 frigates. The radar is also designed to combat complex jammers.[30] HMS Iron Duke was the first Type 23 frigate to receive the Artisan radar during her refit in 2012–13.[31]
It is claimed the radar is five times more capable than the Type 996 radar it replaces.[32][33]
Common Anti-Air Modular Missile
Further information: CAMM (missile family)
CAMM(M), the maritime variant of the Common Anti-Air Modular Missile, started to replace the Sea Wolf missiles on the Type 23 frigates from 2016. CAMM(M) has a longer range of 1–25+ km compared to the 1–10 km offered by the Sea Wolf missile. An option exists to give the missile a surface-attack capability, though it is currently understood the Royal Navy will not take that option, because of cost.[34] Like Sea Wolf, CAMM(M) will be VLS launched; however due to its design, CAMM(M) can be packed much more tightly into the VLS, with up to four CAMM(M) fitting into the space occupied by one Sea Wolf missile.[35] CAMM(M) is known as Sea Ceptor in Royal Navy service.
Martlet Lightweight Multirole Missile
On an unspecified date in early 2019, HMS Sutherland tested a modified mounting for the 30mm cannon which incorporated a launcher for five 'Martlet' Lightweight Multirole Missiles, by firing four of them at a small speedboat target at the Aberporth range in Wales. The concept of mounting the missile alongside the 30mm Bushmaster cannon was tested just 5 months after the idea's conception.
The intended role of the Martlet is to further extend the Type 23's capabilities against small, fast moving targets beyond the current 30mm, GPMG and Minigun options to provide a long range 'stand-off' ability. It is not yet clear whether the Royal Navy intends to equip any more Type 23s with the system.[36]
Anti-ship missile
A replacement for the ageing Harpoon anti-ship missiles was being studied as an interim measure until the Future Cruise/Anti-Ship Weapon (FC/ASW) joint programme between the UK and France is completed in the 2030s.[37][38][39] The interim replacement missile had been planned to be fitted as a stopgap to five of the newer Type-23 frigates as the Harpoon's out-of-service date (OSD) is in 2023.[3] However, in November 2021 the First Sea Lord, Admiral Tony Radakin, told the House of Commons Select Defence Committee that the program "had been paused" and seemed likely to be cancelled.[40]
In 2021 it was reported that only two frigates, Montrose and Kent, were deployed with a full load of eight Harpoon canisters per ship.[3]
Weapons, countermeasures, capabilities and sensors
Anti-ship warfare
Up to 2× 4 Harpoon anti-ship missile launchers for a total of 8 Harpoon anti-ship missiles.
1× BAE Systems 4.5 inch Mark 8 naval gun has an anti-ship role.
Up to one embarked Agusta Westland AW159 Wildcat helicopter potentially equipped with Martlet anti-ship missiles or Sea Venom anti-ship missiles (as of 2021).[46]
Anti-submarine warfare
A Thales Underwater Systems Type 2050 bow sonar scheduled to be replaced by an Ultra Electronics Type 2150 next generation ASW bow sonar in due course.[citation needed]
An Ultra Electronics Type 2031Z towed sonar on five of the Type 23 frigates – no longer in RN service.
A Type 2087 towed sonar on eight of the Type 23 frigates.
2× twin 12.75 in (324 mm) magazine launched torpedo tubes built by SEA Ltd for anti-submarine Sting Ray torpedoes. The tubes are magazine reloaded.
Up to one embarked Agusta Westland AW159 Wildcat or one AgustaWestland EH101 Merlin helicopter can be equipped with 2-4× anti-submarine Sting Ray torpedoes respectively. An embarked Merlin HM2 helicopter is equipped with its own dipping sonar, sonobuoys and radars; For submarine targets, Wildcat relies on the ship's sensors.[47]
Guns
1× BAE Systems 4.5 inch Mark 8 naval gun.
2× 30mm DS30M Mark 2 Automated Small Calibre Guns or 30mm DS30B guns.
2× Miniguns.
4× General-purpose machine guns.
Countermeasures
The Seagnat decoy system allows for the seduction and distraction of radar guided weapons, through active and passive means.
Type 182 towed torpedo decoys.
Type 2070 towed torpedo decoy system.
Thales defence Scorpion Electronic Counter Measures/UAF-1 ESM Jammer. Used to confuse or block enemy radar making the Type 23 frigate harder to detect and or locked onto by enemy radar/sonar guided weapons.
Electronic systems
Navigation: Kelvin Hughes Radar Type 1007 and Racal Decca Type 1008.
fire-control system: Sperry Sea Archer 30 optronic surveillance/director'
Combat Management System: BAE Systems Command System DNA(2)'[48]
Additional capabilities
The Type 23 frigates have sufficient space to embark a small detachment of Royal Marines and their equipment.
PP
Edited for size,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_23_frigate
The Type 23 frigate or Duke class is a class of frigates built for the United Kingdom's Royal Navy. The ships are named after British Dukes, thus leading to the class being commonly known as the Duke class. The first Type 23, HMS Norfolk, was commissioned in 1989, and the sixteenth, HMS St Albans was commissioned in June 2002. They form the core of the Royal Navy's destroyer and frigate fleet and serve alongside the Type 45 destroyers. They were designed for anti-submarine warfare, but have been used for a range of uses.[4] Twelve Type 23 frigates remain in service with the Royal Navy, with three vessels having been sold to the Chilean Navy, and one being retired in 2021.
The Royal Navy's Type 23 frigates will be replaced by the Type 26 Global Combat Ship and the Type 31 frigate.[5] As of 2021 it is anticipated that HMS St Albans will be the last to retire from the Royal Navy, in 2035.[3][6]
The ship was designed by the Royal Corps of Naval Constructors, in close partnership with the prime contractor, Yarrow Shipbuilders.[8] No anti-air warfare system was planned, however the lessons learned during the Falklands War led to the introduction of the vertically launched Sea Wolf missile; In June 1984 BAe Dynamics was awarded a development contract for the missile system.[9][10] Unlike conventional Sea Wolf, the missile is boosted vertically until it clears the ship's superstructure, and then turns to fly directly to the target. Consequently, the ship's structure does not impose no-fire directions that would delay or inhibit missile firing in a conventionally launched system. With the addition of Harpoon surface-to-surface missiles and a medium calibre gun for naval gunfire support, the Type 23 had evolved into a more complex and balanced vessel optimised for general warfare, which introduced a host of new technologies and concepts to the Royal Navy. These included extensive radar cross-section reduction design measures, automation to substantially reduce crew size, a combined diesel-electric and gas (CODLAG) propulsion system providing very quiet running for anti-submarine operations and a large range.[11]
Upgrades and future technologies
The Type 23's propeller is specially designed to reduce underwater noise during anti-submarine operations.
Type 997 Artisan 3D radar on HMS Argyll following her 2010 refit
Mid-life refit
The class underwent[when?] mid-life refits which lasted 12–18 months and cost £15-20m. Aside from refurbishment of the mess decks and drive train, the ships are being fitted with a transom flap which can add up to one knot (1.9 km/h; 1.2 mph) to the top speed[21] and reduce fuel consumption by 13%, and Intersleek anti-fouling paint which added two knots (3.7 km/h; 2.3 mph) to the top speed of Ark Royal.[22] Although the top speed of the Duke class is commonly quoted as 28 knots, the caption of an official Navy photo suggests that Lancaster was capable of 32 knots even before her mid-life refit.[23][24] The Sea Wolf Mid Life Update (SWMLU) improves the sensors and guidance of the missiles, point defences are further improved with new remotely operated 30 mm guns, and Mod 1 of the Mk8 main gun has an all-electric loading system and a smaller radar cross-section. The communications and command systems are also upgraded.
A further Life Extension (LIFEX) Upkeep project saw the Sea Wolf missiles with the new Sea Ceptor anti-air defence missiles;[25] these were first test-fired from HMS Argyll on 4 September 2017.[26]
Sonar 2087
Further information: Sonar 2087
Sonar 2087 is described by its manufacturer as "a towed-array system that enables Type 23 frigates to hunt the latest submarines at considerable distances and locate them beyond the range at which they [submarines] can launch an attack."[27] Sonar 2087 was fitted to eight Type 23 frigates in mid-life refits between 2004 and 2012; the five oldest Type 23 frigates, HMS Montrose, Monmouth, Iron Duke, Lancaster and Argyll are not scheduled to receive Sonar 2087. These ships will instead continue to be employed across the normal range of standing Royal Navy deployments. The Chilean Navy is procuring a number of Sonar 2087 towed arrays from Thales Underwater Systems to equip its multipurpose frigates.[28]
Artisan 3D radar
Main article: Type 997 Artisan radar
The Type 23's original medium-range radar was replaced by BAE Systems Type 997 Artisan 3D radar; the project was worth £100 million and the contract was announced on 4 August 2008.[29] It is a medium-range radar designed to be capable of operating effectively in littoral zones and improving air-defence, anti-surface (anti-ship) and air traffic management capabilities of the Type 23 frigates. The radar is also designed to combat complex jammers.[30] HMS Iron Duke was the first Type 23 frigate to receive the Artisan radar during her refit in 2012–13.[31]
It is claimed the radar is five times more capable than the Type 996 radar it replaces.[32][33]
Common Anti-Air Modular Missile
Further information: CAMM (missile family)
CAMM(M), the maritime variant of the Common Anti-Air Modular Missile, started to replace the Sea Wolf missiles on the Type 23 frigates from 2016. CAMM(M) has a longer range of 1–25+ km compared to the 1–10 km offered by the Sea Wolf missile. An option exists to give the missile a surface-attack capability, though it is currently understood the Royal Navy will not take that option, because of cost.[34] Like Sea Wolf, CAMM(M) will be VLS launched; however due to its design, CAMM(M) can be packed much more tightly into the VLS, with up to four CAMM(M) fitting into the space occupied by one Sea Wolf missile.[35] CAMM(M) is known as Sea Ceptor in Royal Navy service.
Martlet Lightweight Multirole Missile
On an unspecified date in early 2019, HMS Sutherland tested a modified mounting for the 30mm cannon which incorporated a launcher for five 'Martlet' Lightweight Multirole Missiles, by firing four of them at a small speedboat target at the Aberporth range in Wales. The concept of mounting the missile alongside the 30mm Bushmaster cannon was tested just 5 months after the idea's conception.
The intended role of the Martlet is to further extend the Type 23's capabilities against small, fast moving targets beyond the current 30mm, GPMG and Minigun options to provide a long range 'stand-off' ability. It is not yet clear whether the Royal Navy intends to equip any more Type 23s with the system.[36]
Anti-ship missile
A replacement for the ageing Harpoon anti-ship missiles was being studied as an interim measure until the Future Cruise/Anti-Ship Weapon (FC/ASW) joint programme between the UK and France is completed in the 2030s.[37][38][39] The interim replacement missile had been planned to be fitted as a stopgap to five of the newer Type-23 frigates as the Harpoon's out-of-service date (OSD) is in 2023.[3] However, in November 2021 the First Sea Lord, Admiral Tony Radakin, told the House of Commons Select Defence Committee that the program "had been paused" and seemed likely to be cancelled.[40]
In 2021 it was reported that only two frigates, Montrose and Kent, were deployed with a full load of eight Harpoon canisters per ship.[3]
Weapons, countermeasures, capabilities and sensors
Anti-ship warfare
Up to 2× 4 Harpoon anti-ship missile launchers for a total of 8 Harpoon anti-ship missiles.
1× BAE Systems 4.5 inch Mark 8 naval gun has an anti-ship role.
Up to one embarked Agusta Westland AW159 Wildcat helicopter potentially equipped with Martlet anti-ship missiles or Sea Venom anti-ship missiles (as of 2021).[46]
Anti-submarine warfare
A Thales Underwater Systems Type 2050 bow sonar scheduled to be replaced by an Ultra Electronics Type 2150 next generation ASW bow sonar in due course.[citation needed]
An Ultra Electronics Type 2031Z towed sonar on five of the Type 23 frigates – no longer in RN service.
A Type 2087 towed sonar on eight of the Type 23 frigates.
2× twin 12.75 in (324 mm) magazine launched torpedo tubes built by SEA Ltd for anti-submarine Sting Ray torpedoes. The tubes are magazine reloaded.
Up to one embarked Agusta Westland AW159 Wildcat or one AgustaWestland EH101 Merlin helicopter can be equipped with 2-4× anti-submarine Sting Ray torpedoes respectively. An embarked Merlin HM2 helicopter is equipped with its own dipping sonar, sonobuoys and radars; For submarine targets, Wildcat relies on the ship's sensors.[47]
Guns
1× BAE Systems 4.5 inch Mark 8 naval gun.
2× 30mm DS30M Mark 2 Automated Small Calibre Guns or 30mm DS30B guns.
2× Miniguns.
4× General-purpose machine guns.
Countermeasures
The Seagnat decoy system allows for the seduction and distraction of radar guided weapons, through active and passive means.
Type 182 towed torpedo decoys.
Type 2070 towed torpedo decoy system.
Thales defence Scorpion Electronic Counter Measures/UAF-1 ESM Jammer. Used to confuse or block enemy radar making the Type 23 frigate harder to detect and or locked onto by enemy radar/sonar guided weapons.
Electronic systems
Navigation: Kelvin Hughes Radar Type 1007 and Racal Decca Type 1008.
fire-control system: Sperry Sea Archer 30 optronic surveillance/director'
Combat Management System: BAE Systems Command System DNA(2)'[48]
Additional capabilities
The Type 23 frigates have sufficient space to embark a small detachment of Royal Marines and their equipment.
PP
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Apparently the protective casing of a T23 forward gun is made of fibreglass and will only withstand heavy seas from forward without taking 'damage'.
Guns
1× BAE Systems 4.5 inch Mark 8 naval gun.
2× 30mm DS30M Mark 2 Automated Small Calibre Guns or 30mm DS30B guns.
2× Miniguns.
4× General-purpose machine guns.
Thanks pp and PN but I don't think the 'fibreglass' issue applies to the smaller calibre weapons amidships. It's also not likely there will be any danger of flooding beneath their mountings.
Guns
1× BAE Systems 4.5 inch Mark 8 naval gun.
2× 30mm DS30M Mark 2 Automated Small Calibre Guns or 30mm DS30B guns.
2× Miniguns.
4× General-purpose machine guns.
Thanks pp and PN but I don't think the 'fibreglass' issue applies to the smaller calibre weapons amidships. It's also not likely there will be any danger of flooding beneath their mountings.
-
Pontius Navigator
- Chief Pilot
- Posts: 14669
- Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:17 am
- Location: Gravity be the clue
- Gender:
- Age: 80
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
I can imagine a formed, rigid structure withstanding seas from one aspect and not from another. But I cannot imagine such a structure on a gun mantle. By its very nature it should be flexible.
Having been in a modern gun mount where they were mopping water did not look the gun chamber. Probably wrong and the camera crew held well back.
Having been in a modern gun mount where they were mopping water did not look the gun chamber. Probably wrong and the camera crew held well back.
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
More photos:
The gun system has a combination of electrical and hydraulic components and the full system penetrates up to three deck levels below the weather deck; deep magazine, gun control room and power room, gunbay and the gunhouse.
This is the gunbay where the rounds arrive from the magazine two decks below and are fed up to the unmanned gunhouse up on deck.
The weapon is semi-automatic and can be operated by a smaller crew than its predecessors. With no personnel in the gunhouse, loading is supported by personnel in the gunbay to load the feed ring and in the deep-magazine to pass ammunition to the gunbay. The captain of the gun in the control room ensures continued weapon readiness and the gun controller in the operations room aims and fires the weapon. The gun has a rate of fire of about 25 rounds per minute and a range of 12 nm (22 km; 27.5 km with the newer High Explosive Extended Range round).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4.5-inch_Mark_8_naval_gun
- BAE Mk 8 gun.png (118.34 KiB) Viewed 443 times
This is the gunbay where the rounds arrive from the magazine two decks below and are fed up to the unmanned gunhouse up on deck.
- Mk 8 Gunbay.png (158.82 KiB) Viewed 443 times
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4.5-inch_Mark_8_naval_gun
-
CharlieOneSix
- Chief Pilot
- Posts: 5022
- Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:58 pm
- Location: NE Scotland
- Gender:
- Age: 79
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Unlike FD2 I was a pure Airy Fairy with little knowledge of ship design niceties so I haven’t commented here, but I once had intimate knowledge of the rate of fire of a Guided Missile Destroyer’s 4.5 inch gun. I was flying HMS Devonshire’s Wessex and we we briefed to do gunfire spotting for the 4.5 inch gun which was to fire on an unoccupied shoal type island near the Barrier Reef.
After the first few rounds our Observer radioed back a correction. Next thing we had multiple splashes appear in the sea a bit too close for comfort as for whatever reason the correction had been misapplied. I think we all transmitted ‘Stop firing’ x3 together.
The helicopter pilots' mantra: If it hasn't gone wrong then it's just about to...
https://www.glenbervie-weather.org
https://www.glenbervie-weather.org
-
Pontius Navigator
- Chief Pilot
- Posts: 14669
- Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:17 am
- Location: Gravity be the clue
- Gender:
- Age: 80
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Moot point who found whom.
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Impressed colour remains unchanged, possibly darker.
"WTF have we hit?" How many guesses?
"WTF have we hit?" How many guesses?
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Other question for the 'maritimers' - why did they appear to not start active pinging with ship or helo when contact was 'lost'?
I assume sending the helo to 'listen' in a position where the sub was 24 hours ago(!) was TV crap?
I assume sending the helo to 'listen' in a position where the sub was 24 hours ago(!) was TV crap?
-
Pontius Navigator
- Chief Pilot
- Posts: 14669
- Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:17 am
- Location: Gravity be the clue
- Gender:
- Age: 80
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
1. Good question
2. Correct and only having 30 buoys on the ship. Really?
Previous episode they had a RAS ffs.
There was one brief shot, aren't they all, that showed what looked like a barrier of perhaps 8 buoys to the SE of the ship. Nice to see nothing changed there.
As for not knowing where the submarine was with a furthest on circle of 240 miles, it was going for the cable wasn't it? (If you believe the script writters).
2. Correct and only having 30 buoys on the ship. Really?
Previous episode they had a RAS ffs.
There was one brief shot, aren't they all, that showed what looked like a barrier of perhaps 8 buoys to the SE of the ship. Nice to see nothing changed there.
As for not knowing where the submarine was with a furthest on circle of 240 miles, it was going for the cable wasn't it? (If you believe the script writters).
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
PN wrote:2.Correct and only having 30 buoys left? on the ship.
-
Rossian
- Capt
- Posts: 979
- Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2015 1:27 pm
- Location: Morayshire Scotland
- Gender:
- Age: 82
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Sending the helo out to 24 hour old position was what was known in the trade as a "dick dangle" as in "dangling your dick out the window and hoping to get laid". Some of the dialogue sounded really naff "We'll be in contact in 10 mins" really?? Who has the crystal ball today?
I think there has been a lot of very careful line treading to avoid any compromising of sensitive stuff which was always a risk in a programme like this. Producers I think are more interested in coming up with the "human interest stuff" for the general public eg the chats to the kids at home, the new chef finding his feet, the AB getting her badge and WApp-ing it to her mum than the stuff some of us would be really interested in. Also you can't have a TV prog which shows the sometimes mind-numbing tedium of day in and day out of a protracted tracking mission it just wouldn't work.
And for what its worth I'd put a small amount of money on Ivan deliberately trying to chop off the tail. And to an extent he succeeded in curtailing the mission. Next time you bastard.....
The Ancient Mariner
I think there has been a lot of very careful line treading to avoid any compromising of sensitive stuff which was always a risk in a programme like this. Producers I think are more interested in coming up with the "human interest stuff" for the general public eg the chats to the kids at home, the new chef finding his feet, the AB getting her badge and WApp-ing it to her mum than the stuff some of us would be really interested in. Also you can't have a TV prog which shows the sometimes mind-numbing tedium of day in and day out of a protracted tracking mission it just wouldn't work.
And for what its worth I'd put a small amount of money on Ivan deliberately trying to chop off the tail. And to an extent he succeeded in curtailing the mission. Next time you bastard.....
The Ancient Mariner
-
Undried Plum
- Chief Pilot
- Posts: 7308
- Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2018 8:45 pm
- Location: 56°N 4°W
Re: Russian submarine collided with British warship part in rare event
Having watched it: utter gobshite.
Purest anti-Russian *****, from and through the filter of Integrity Initiative:- hogwash!
The breathless claim the that warship saved the international subsea cable from being cut by the dastardly attempt by the Russky submarine, on the surface with its attack and surveillance periscopes and its comms mast very obviously poked up for public view, is so absurd as to be not worth talking about by any entity other than The Daily **** Mail.
If the Russkies wanted to cut, which they don't by the way, those cables, they would have done so years/decades ago, out of sight.
Purest anti-Russian *****, from and through the filter of Integrity Initiative:- hogwash!
The breathless claim the that warship saved the international subsea cable from being cut by the dastardly attempt by the Russky submarine, on the surface with its attack and surveillance periscopes and its comms mast very obviously poked up for public view, is so absurd as to be not worth talking about by any entity other than The Daily **** Mail.
If the Russkies wanted to cut, which they don't by the way, those cables, they would have done so years/decades ago, out of sight.