Forgotten pilots or flights...

Message
Author
User avatar
CharlieOneSix
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 5004
Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:58 pm
Location: NE Scotland
Gender:
Age: 79

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#161 Post by CharlieOneSix » Thu May 13, 2021 8:32 am

CharlieOneSix wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 8:23 am
FD2 wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 6:31 am
.........Despite their problems over 2,500 Barracudas were delivered to the Navy. There was a song at the time titled 'Somewhere a Barra's Crashing'.......
From 'The Fleet Air Arm Song Book'

Somewhere a Barracuda's Always Pranging
(Tune: Pedro The Fisherman)


Somewhere a Barracuda's always pranging
Dive brakes hanging down.
Somewhere a Barra's diving - Merlin banging,
Pilot's pants are brown.
Whistling down towards the sea,
A.L.T. bags of 'G'
Wings will never stand the strain.

Night navigation with the compass on "Setting"
Pilot's getting twitch.
While in the back the "O" and T.A.G. are sweating.
Both are betting 'Ditch'.
Did he have his finger in? Was it gin caused the spin?
Can we blame the hydraulics once again?

Frame 25's are cracking, Fairey's slacking
Large scale sacking due,
But soon we'll have the Barra V
Longer may we stay alive
Then we'll know that Fairey's have a clue.
The helicopter pilots' mantra: If it hasn't gone wrong then it's just about to...
https://www.glenbervie-weather.org

User avatar
FD2
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 5110
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 10:11 pm
Location: New Zealand
Gender:
Age: 76

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#162 Post by FD2 » Thu May 13, 2021 11:29 am

Thanks C16! Thanks for the kind words GG - you won't regret the purchase. 811 Squadron photo the Boss is regular RN but isn't wearing wings. Will have to investigate that.

Some photos from 'Bring Back My Stringbag':


Godley 1.jpg

Godley 2.jpg

Godley 3.jpg

G-CPTN
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 7593
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:22 pm
Location: Tynedale
Gender:
Age: 79

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#163 Post by G-CPTN » Thu May 13, 2021 11:49 am

Wings on his starboard sleeve?

User avatar
CharlieOneSix
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 5004
Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:58 pm
Location: NE Scotland
Gender:
Age: 79

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#164 Post by CharlieOneSix » Thu May 13, 2021 12:08 pm

G-CPTN wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 11:49 am
Wings on his starboard sleeve?
No, never - always on the left one. That is odd though.

EDIT : All I can find is Lt/Cdr HS Hayes DSC, CO 811 Squadron 2/42- 1/43. Oops, just noticed I posted the song twice.Apologies!
The helicopter pilots' mantra: If it hasn't gone wrong then it's just about to...
https://www.glenbervie-weather.org

User avatar
CharlieOneSix
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 5004
Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:58 pm
Location: NE Scotland
Gender:
Age: 79

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#165 Post by CharlieOneSix » Thu May 13, 2021 12:34 pm

This might interest TGG - Charles Lamb's autobiography "War in a Stringbag". The book came out in the late 70's which is when I bought my copy. Still available.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_L ... y_officer)
Commander Charles Lamb fought an exceptional war flying the slow and obsolete Fairey Swordfish for the Fleet Air Arm. It was an antiquated machine, but it could outmanoeuvre almost any other aircraft, and in Charles Lamb’s hands, the ‘Stringbag’ – as the torpedo bomber was affectionately known – was a deadly weapon.

Charles Lamb fought in the thick of the action. This is his story, from the first day of war as a Lieutenant on board Courageous, to the accident aboard Implacable in action against the Japanese in June 1945 which ended his war.

A rare account of determination, action and spirit by a man who was an inspiration to those around him.
lamb.JPG
lamb.JPG (32.6 KiB) Viewed 487 times
The helicopter pilots' mantra: If it hasn't gone wrong then it's just about to...
https://www.glenbervie-weather.org

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#166 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Thu May 13, 2021 1:58 pm

CharlieOneSix wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 12:34 pm
This might interest TGG - Charles Lamb's autobiography "War in a Stringbag". The book came out in the late 70's which is when I bought my copy. Still available.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_L ... y_officer)
Commander Charles Lamb fought an exceptional war flying the slow and obsolete Fairey Swordfish for the Fleet Air Arm. It was an antiquated machine, but it could outmanoeuvre almost any other aircraft, and in Charles Lamb’s hands, the ‘Stringbag’ – as the torpedo bomber was affectionately known – was a deadly weapon.

Charles Lamb fought in the thick of the action. This is his story, from the first day of war as a Lieutenant on board Courageous, to the accident aboard Implacable in action against the Japanese in June 1945 which ended his war.

A rare account of determination, action and spirit by a man who was an inspiration to those around him.
lamb.JPG
Thanks for the recommendation C16. Purchased. I hope I am at home when it arrives as I am currently in the doghouse with my better half for purchasing "too many aviation books and we will need a bigger house to house your growing library!" Of course this logic is partially flawed. You can never have too many aviation books but she is right, my study is groaning. ;)))
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

John Edward Giles Kershaw

#167 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Thu May 13, 2021 3:28 pm

Had a long WhatsApp chat with an old school friend who has thrice visited southern polar regions, once with the South African National Antarctic Expedition and twice with the British Antarctic Survey, once as a Base Commander with BAS. He mentioned the very interesting article in March's Aeroplane Magazine covering pilot Giles Kershaw's adventurous life flying in Polar regions and the niche he carved out for blue ice landings on the Antarctic continent.
The very first wheeled aircraft to land at Patriot Hills was a De Haviland Twin Otter on December 4, 1986. The pilot, Giles Kershaw, had to land at several points on the Antarctic Peninsula during the flight south to refuel. Onboard the Twin Otter was Glaciologist Dr Charles Swithinbank, former Head of Earth Sciences at the British Antarctic Survey (BAS). Swithinbank had been charged by ANI with the responsibility of finding a suitable blue-ice runway on which larger, conventional commercial aircraft could land. He recalls his first impressions back in the 1980s of Patriot Hills.

“A bleaker place would be hard to imagine. The wind was cutting through our clothing. A few small bundles at our feet were all that stood between us and encroaching hypothermia. We pitched our tiny mountain dome tent but tent pegs were useless because the surface was like concrete. We laboriously screwed ice screws into the ground, one by one, and attached the guy ropes. All my life I had enjoyed the luxury of pyramid tents that felt safe in almost any wind. Now I was to live in a survival tent made for backpacking mountaineers who did not seek comfort.”

Several days of surveying revealed a suitable landing strip and the following season, the DC-4 made its historic first flight.

The DC-4 aircraft was replaced in 1989 by a DC-6 which, in turn, was replaced by a Lockheed Hercules L-382 in 1993. Since 2000, an Ilyushin 76 TD has flown passengers and cargo from Punta Arenas to Antarctica. Twin Otter and Basler BT-67 – a DC-3 conversion – ski-aircraft are used for flights within the Antarctic interior.

Adventure Network International

Giles Kershaw2.JPG
GilesKershaw.JPG

I had heard of this chap before and was sorry to hear that had been killed in 1990 while flying a gyrocopter in Antarctica for national Geographic. His obituary, sadly, sums up his life far better than I can.

Giles KershawGiles Kershaw
JOHN EDWARD GILES KERSHAW died in a flying accident on Jones Ice Shelf, Antarctica, on 5 March 1990. He was born in India on 27 August 1948,andatan early age became intent on a flying career. Failing to pass an RAF pilot's medical because of his eyesight, he obtained civil licences and built up flying time as an instructor and company pilot. He joined the British Antarctic Survey to fly Twin Otter aircraft in 1974, and in the course of the next 15 years became the most accomplished pilot in Antarctic aviation history. Uniquely among polar pilots, he was
equally at home in the highly structured world of airline flying. He served with Britannia Airways as captain of Boeing 737 aircraft, and at the time of his death was on leave from Cathay
Pacific, where he flew as first officer on a Boeing 747

Giles Kersahw.JPG
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
CharlieOneSix
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 5004
Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:58 pm
Location: NE Scotland
Gender:
Age: 79

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#168 Post by CharlieOneSix » Thu May 13, 2021 4:36 pm

CharlieOneSix wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 12:08 pm
EDIT : ...All I can find is Lt/Cdr HS Hayes DSC, CO 811 Squadron 2/42- 1/43....
Some more - he got a bar to his DSC in 1953. Extract from The London Gazette, 10 November 1953, Page 6002:
Bar to the Distinguished Service Cross. Commander Harry Stanley HAYES, D.S.C.,Royal Navy, H.M.S. COCKADE.
Surely a ship of that size (Destroyer) at that time would only have one Commander rank on board and that would be the ship's Captain? HMS Cockade was very active during the Korean War.

Also from Forces War Records found out that he was in 801 Squadron in 1940/41 and that by 1955 he had the rank of Captain.

EDIT....More....sadly in 2005 all his medals were sold in Australia for $21,500. https://www.noble.com.au/auctions/lot/?id=2521

The associated text makes it clear he must have been aircrew:
DSC: London Gazette 1 January 1941. 'For outstanding zeal and courage whilst serving with 801 Squadron.'

DSC (bar): London Gazette 10 November 1953. 'For outstanding leadership, skill and devotion to duty whilst in command of HMS Cockade in operations in Korean waters.'

MID: London Gazette 9 August 1940. 'For good services whilst serving with 801 Squadron in an aerial attack on oil tanks in Norway.'

Together with Mention in Despatches Certificate; official Admiralty congratulatory letter for the award of the Distinguished Service Cross; copy of Admiralty letter of appreciation on recipient's transfer to the Retired List;
The helicopter pilots' mantra: If it hasn't gone wrong then it's just about to...
https://www.glenbervie-weather.org

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Harry Thorne "Mitch" Mitchell

#169 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Thu May 13, 2021 6:06 pm

CharlieOneSix wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 4:36 pm


EDIT....More....sadly in 2005 all his medals were sold in Australia for $21,500. https://www.noble.com.au/auctions/lot/?id=2521
Another potentially sad tale. Have been following up on the Battle of Britain pilot, Harry Thorne "Mitch" Mitchell, who later commanded RCAF111 Squadron in their fight against the Japanese in the Aleutian Islands.

Mitchell.JPG
Mitchell.JPG (48.19 KiB) Viewed 450 times

https://www.rcaf111fsquadron.com/pilots.html
RAF F/L
DFC, MiD
Born in Port Hope, Ontario, 1 October 1912.
Educated at Charterhouse and King's College, London,
(Mother living at Milford, Surrey at time of DFC).
Married aspiring actress Rita Cross in 1936 in Gleneagle, Qc.
They had three children.
(Rita later started a real estate business in Ottawa).
Joined the RAF in October 1938.
Appointed Acting P/O on Probation, 14 December 1938.
Graded P/O from 6 January 1940.
Flew in the Battle of France.
Flew in the Battle of Britain.
Appointed F/O 6 January 1941.
Attached to RCAF in Canada, 8 Jan. 1941 as an instructor.
Promoted to F/L (war sub) 6 January 1942
Joined 111 Sq. RCAF in Alaska.
Assumed command of 111 in July 1942.
Gave command to Ken Boomer in August & then posted to
Western Air Command.
Returned to the UK.
Released from the RAF in 1945
He was an Attaché at the Canadian Embasy in Washington.
Through Ernie Bushell (owner of CTV Ottawa and a good Harry "Mitch" Mitchell
friend of the family) he got a job there as a news anchor but soon lost it for (it is claimed) coming to work intoxicated.
He and Rita split up in the late 1960's, she stayed in Ottawa and became a successful business woman & he moved to Vancouver.
Nothing is known of him past that point and his family is very interested in finding out what happened to him.
(It is believed that he lived with a woman for some years while there).
He may have died on the streets (PTSD?) and be buried in an unmarked grave. Any info would be greatly appreciated.
http://acesofww2.com/can/aces/mitchell/
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#170 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Fri May 14, 2021 7:57 pm

CharlieOneSix wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 12:34 pm
This might interest TGG - Charles Lamb's autobiography "War in a Stringbag". The book came out in the late 70's which is when I bought my copy. Still available.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_L ... y_officer)
Commander Charles Lamb fought an exceptional war flying the slow and obsolete Fairey Swordfish for the Fleet Air Arm. It was an antiquated machine, but it could outmanoeuvre almost any other aircraft, and in Charles Lamb’s hands, the ‘Stringbag’ – as the torpedo bomber was affectionately known – was a deadly weapon.

Charles Lamb fought in the thick of the action. This is his story, from the first day of war as a Lieutenant on board Courageous, to the accident aboard Implacable in action against the Japanese in June 1945 which ended his war.

A rare account of determination, action and spirit by a man who was an inspiration to those around him.
Book arrived while I was out today. Received the lecture from the better half, now looking forward to reading it this weekend... :-bd

C16.JPG
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#171 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Sat May 15, 2021 1:11 pm

I see that Charles Lamb's was the last aircraft to land on HMS Courageous before she was sunk...

HMS Courageous was the first Royal Navy ship to be sunk in World War II. His war got off to a quick and shocking start!


Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
ian16th
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 10029
Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2015 9:35 am
Location: KZN South Coast with the bananas
Gender:
Age: 87

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#172 Post by ian16th » Sat May 15, 2021 1:47 pm

Nice not to need sub-titles!
Cynicism improves with age

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#173 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Sat May 15, 2021 1:51 pm

ian16th wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 1:47 pm
Nice not to need sub-titles!
Did the noise of all those aircraft engines play havoc with your hearing ian16th?
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
ian16th
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 10029
Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2015 9:35 am
Location: KZN South Coast with the bananas
Gender:
Age: 87

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#174 Post by ian16th » Sat May 15, 2021 2:01 pm

TheGreenGoblin wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 1:51 pm
ian16th wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 1:47 pm
Nice not to need sub-titles!
Did the noise of all those aircraft engines play havoc with your hearing ian16th?
The engines that buggered my earlugs were RR Avon's.

4 continuous years on the line with Valiant's.
Cynicism improves with age

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#175 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Sat May 15, 2021 2:14 pm

ian16th wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 2:01 pm
TheGreenGoblin wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 1:51 pm
ian16th wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 1:47 pm
Nice not to need sub-titles!
Did the noise of all those aircraft engines play havoc with your hearing ian16th?
The engines that buggered my earlugs were RR Avon's.

4 continuous years on the line with Valiant's.
I guess ear mufflers weren't much in vogue during those 4 years! Just noticed your comment about hearing aid batteries. Really sorry you are being incommoded by SA greed and incompetence!
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Commander Robin Kilroy DSC

#176 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Sat May 15, 2021 5:58 pm

Charles Lamb's book raises the name of another pilot we should look at here, namely Commander Robin Kilroy DSC. There seems to be precious little detail about his FAA career online, which is very surprising given his extraordinary life. Perhaps the Navy folk here can fill in the gaps...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boleh_(yacht)
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Re: Commander Robin Kilroy DSC

#177 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Sat May 15, 2021 6:12 pm

TheGreenGoblin wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 5:58 pm
Charles Lamb's book raises the name of another pilot we should look at here, namely Commander Robin Kilroy DSC. There seems to be precious little detail about his FAA career online, which is very surprising given his extraordinary life. Perhaps the Navy folk here can fill in the gaps...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boleh_(yacht)
Some really good detail here mind...

http://www.ocotilloroad.com/geneal/kilroy1.html
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
FD2
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 5110
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 10:11 pm
Location: New Zealand
Gender:
Age: 76

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#178 Post by FD2 » Mon May 17, 2021 6:07 am

GG - Harry Mitchell - sad end for the man. Alcohol serving as a tranquilliser as was often the case with men back then - I expect we've all had a few friends with the problem.

It looks as though Harry Hayes was General List - in a minority of aircrew during the War. Maybe he didn't want to advertise the fact - see the marvellous book 'HMS Leviathan' by John Winton. I experienced the bias a couple of times myself from former fish-head friends. Maybe he had just bought a new uniform and needed to get busy with needle and thread!

I came across these photos I downloaded years ago - I don't where from - but there's a good one of a Barracuda showing its sleek lines over somewhere GG will recognise and another of a couple parked on Formidable's deck. Hope they watched out for that tall mast. (A25 Song) Note the lack of flying helmet!

Barracuda over Capetown.jpg

HMS FORMIDABLE Madagascar April or May 1942.jpg

User avatar
TheGreenGoblin
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 17596
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:02 pm
Location: With the Water People near Trappist-1

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#179 Post by TheGreenGoblin » Mon May 17, 2021 8:48 am

FD2 wrote:
Mon May 17, 2021 6:07 am
GG - Harry Mitchell - sad end for the man. Alcohol serving as a tranquilliser as was often the case with men back then - I expect we've all had a few friends with the problem.

It looks as though Harry Hayes was General List - in a minority of aircrew during the War. Maybe he didn't want to advertise the fact - see the marvellous book 'HMS Leviathan' by John Winton. I experienced the bias a couple of times myself from former fish-head friends. Maybe he had just bought a new uniform and needed to get busy with needle and thread!

I came across these photos I downloaded years ago - I don't where from - but there's a good one of a Barracuda showing its sleek lines over somewhere GG will recognise and another of a couple parked on Formidable's deck. Hope they watched out for that tall mast. (A25 Song) Note the lack of flying helmet!


Barracuda over Capetown.jpg



HMS FORMIDABLE Madagascar April or May 1942.jpg
"I expect we've all had a few friends with the problem." - Sadly so!

That is such a great shot of a Barracuda, flying past Platteklip Gorge with Table Mountain and the Twelve Apostles off his 4 o'clock and Lions Head in the background and Cape Town itself in view below him with Devils Peak coming up at one o'clock. That would make a wonderful desk photograph.
Though you remain
Convinced
"To be alive
You must have somewhere
To go
Your destination remains
Elusive."

User avatar
ian16th
Chief Pilot
Chief Pilot
Posts: 10029
Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2015 9:35 am
Location: KZN South Coast with the bananas
Gender:
Age: 87

Re: Forgotten pilots or flights...

#180 Post by ian16th » Mon May 17, 2021 11:51 am

FD2 wrote:
Mon May 17, 2021 6:07 am
GG - Harry Mitchell - sad end for the man. Alcohol serving as a tranquilliser as was often the case with men back then - I expect we've all had a few friends with the problem.

It looks as though Harry Hayes was General List - in a minority of aircrew during the War. Maybe he didn't want to advertise the fact - see the marvellous book 'HMS Leviathan' by John Winton. I experienced the bias a couple of times myself from former fish-head friends. Maybe he had just bought a new uniform and needed to get busy with needle and thread!

I came across these photos I downloaded years ago - I don't where from - but there's a good one of a Barracuda showing its sleek lines over somewhere GG will recognise and another of a couple parked on Formidable's deck. Hope they watched out for that tall mast. (A25 Song) Note the lack of flying helmet!
I found it a very sad story.

Haven't read it for years, dunno if I still have it, or if it was seeded out in our house moves.
Cynicism improves with age

Post Reply