Airlines warn of 5G flight disruption

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Re: Airlines warn of 5G flight disruption

#21 Post by PHXPhlyer » Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:23 pm

FAA approves more airliners -- including some smaller, regional jets -- to fly near 5G towers ... index.html

(CNN)The Federal Aviation Administration has cleared more commercial airliners -- notably more smaller, regional jets -- to fly in the situations where pilots consider possible 5G interference to be the most dangerous.

In a new statement, the FAA says it has issued more approvals that allow 78% of the US commercial airliner fleet to perform low-visibility landings at airports near where wireless companies deployed 5G. Airlines said 5G towers set to go live nationwide on Wednesday could cause interference and errors in radar altimeters -- instruments commercial pilots need to perform such landings -- since they operate on a similar radio frequency.
Verizon and AT&T, which owns CNN's parent company, this week delayed the rollout at some airports while a permanent fix to prevent inference is in the works.

Airplane models with one of the 13 cleared altimeters include all Boeing 717, 737, 747, 757, 767, 777, 787, MD-10/-11 jets; all Airbus A300, A310, A319, A320, A330, A340, A350 and A380 models; and some Embraer 170 and 190 regional jets, the FAA said.
"The FAA is working diligently to determine which remaining altimeters are reliable and accurate where 5G is deployed in the United States," the statement said. "We anticipate some altimeters will be too susceptible to 5G interference. To preserve safety, aircraft with those altimeters will be prohibited from performing low-visibility landings where 5G is deployed because the altimeter could provide inaccurate information."
But a sizable and less visible portion of the aviation industry remains in limbo.
"Crisis has not been averted," says Faye Malarkey Black, who as Regional Airline Association president represents the carriers connecting larger hubs to dozens of smaller cities around the country.

The flights have brands like American Eagle, Delta Connection, and United Express. The flights are contracted out to companies or subsidiaries like Envoy, ExpressJet, Republic Airways and SkyWest Airlines.
The Federal Aviation Administration has approved procedures for more than a dozen models of Boeing and Airbus planes to perform low-visibility landings at some airports where new 5G cell phone technology could interfere and throw off critical flight equipment. Verizon and AT&T, which owns CNN's parent company, this week delayed the rollout at some airports while a permanent fix to prevent inference is in the works.
But the FAA's approvals do not cover many of the smaller planes flown by regional carriers, Black said.
"Manufacturers for regional aircraft have submitted those same plans to the FAA," Black told CNN. "They have not heard word back. We don't know when they'll hear word back."
The FAA did not immediately comment on the matter.
One of the regional carriers, SkyWest, told CNN late Wednesday that it has "not received updates from the FAA on mitigations for our fleets."
"If weather deteriorates at any affected location, there remains potential for significant operational impact until full mitigations can be put into place for all commercial aircraft," SkyWest said.
But the company has already had to deal with a few diversions.
"Weather conditions at some airports led to a small number of flight cancels and diversions this morning as a result of 5G implementation," the company said in a statement. "We will process changes as soon as we receive the FAA's mitigations for our E175 aircraft in low visibility conditions."
"As always, we will not compromise safety," Skywest added.
Several other regional carriers referred questions to the RAA or did not respond.

The issue meant that a United Express flight headed to San Francisco on Thursday was stuck circling the airport because of poor weather. United acknowledged the issue. SkyWest did not immediately comment on this particular flight.
"If there's weather at the destination airport or the forecast of weather, then the dispatch isn't going to release that flight," Black said, leading to a delay or cancelation. "In the instance that aircraft are enroute and are inbound to an airport, and fog rolls in ... then you're going to have to circle, and then eventually divert to a reliever airport."
The result leaves travelers in unexpected places, and planes and crews out of position for the next flight.
"The ripple effects of this will be very substantial," Black told CNN. "All of our members are looking into it. They are developing these contingency plans."


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Re: Airlines warn of 5G flight disruption

#22 Post by llondel » Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:30 pm

Seeing an article on LinkedIn ( ... 602200064/ if it works for people), reporting various issues in the US now that it's been turned on. It claims that 787s seem particularly susceptible.
#FAA Warns 787's are especially susceptible to 5G, FAA has published 1400 5G NOTAMS and international #airlines cancel US flights after FAA warns of catastrophic disruption.

All to do with #5G rollout in the US today. The #FAA warned #pilots not to use their #radioaltimeter at more than 80 #airports in the #US.

Video shows a Caravan encountering the following phenomenon on it's #RadioAltimeter while #flying over an area where they are broadcasting in the C-band.

Edit note: Please note, I am not the owner of this video. The video is to show how C-Band interference can affect radar altimeters. It it up to the FAA and operators to monitor this phenomena and to take immediately action if this occurs. The FAA has already published an AD regarding the 'Risk of Potential Adverse Effects on Radio Altimeters' Also, #EASA has published an SIB regarding the operations to #aerodromes located in #UnitedStates and the potential interference from 5G ground stations that might impair the reliable functioning of #radioaltimeters installed on the #aircraft. #Safetyfirst

UPDATE: Some pilots are indicating that they experienced problems with its radar altimeter on Wednesday. Embraer #E190 experience problems at HPN and another #pilot commented that he had three false indications.
Having watched the video (altimeter dial spinning clockwise), at least it's clear that it's not to be trusted. Just thinking of a few crashes caused by instruments that don't clearly show they've got a problem.

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Re: Airlines warn of 5G flight disruption

#23 Post by PHXPhlyer » Sat Jun 18, 2022 5:33 pm

Mobile phone carriers agree to delay rolling out some 5G service near airports for another year, FAA says ... index.html

Mobile phone carriers have agreed to another delay in rolling out some 5G service to prevent interference with airplane technology, the Federal Aviation Administration said Friday.

The FAA said the delay, for an additional year, will allow more time for the permanent fix: replacing or filtering the devices that measure an aircraft’s distance from the ground, called radar altimeters. The new technology’s promises include faster speeds, but aviation officials say the radio waves can be picked up in some cases by the radar altimeter.

How last week's 5G deployment went so wrong
The new timeline prompted concerns from major airlines and operators of regional jets, the latter of which would be subject to an even more aggressive end-of-2022 deadline. The Regional Airline Association said the FAA is “pressuring airlines to meet implausible deadlines.”

“Airlines are being asked to shoulder the blame for a process that should have been foreseen years ago before telecom expanded into aviation used spectrum,” RAA CEO Faye Malarkey Black said. “Our government partners should not deflect shortfalls in interagency coordination onto the airline industry.”

Airlines for America, a trade group that represents major airlines, wrote in a letter that “changes affecting avionics performance have always relied upon well-considered industry consensus standards, exhaustive testing and critical FAA certification oversight, often measured in years.”

The 5G-airlines crisis was mostly averted. Here's what happened - and what we still don't know
“We have serious concerns that the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has placed the burden on the aviation industry to act in a way that would previously be considered, by the FAA itself, to be reckless in the context of design changes to safety-critical avionics,” the letter reads.

The letter said safety would be “jeopardized by the rushed approach to avionics modifications amid pressure from the telecommunications companies.”

Spokesman Dan Stohr of the National Air Carriers Association, with members including budget airlines, said it would continue to “express our concerns and figure out a way to most safely get the planes equipped in the ways that we need to in order to safely operate.”

The FAA said the wireless carriers voluntarily offered the additional year delay. The timeline calls for retrofitting smaller regional jets “by the end of 2022” and larger jets by summer 2023.

An AT&T spokesperson told CNN that work in recent months has allowed it to develop “a more tailored approach to controlling signal strength around runways” for the C band, the portion of radio spectrum used for 5G.

“Though our FCC licenses allow us to fully deploy much-needed C-Band spectrum right now, we have chosen in good faith to implement these more tailored precautionary measures so that airlines have additional time to retrofit equipment,” the AT&T spokesperson said. “We appreciate the FAA’s support of this approach, and we will continue to work with the aviation community as we move toward the expiration of all such voluntary measures by next summer.”

Verizon executive vice president Craig Silliman told CNN it “will lift the voluntary limitations on our 5G network deployment around airports in a staged approach over the coming months meaning even more consumers and businesses will benefit from the tremendous capabilities of 5G technology. ”

“Today’s announcement identifies a path forward that will enable Verizon to make full use of our C-Band spectrum for 5G around airports on an accelerated and defined schedule,” Silliman said.

Industry and government officials have held a series of meetings on the matter this year, most recently on Friday.


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