Air Force One

[Wodrick]

There was a program on UK C5 a couple of nights ago "Secrets of AF1"

It was said that AF1 is always accompanied by a backup and a command center.
The CC, it was stated, was where the President would control a major conflict.
this CC is 747-400 based and it was also stated that it could remain airborne for a week.

Now I'm an Avionics Engineer but that got an incredulous mutter from me.
Surely a 747-400 with enough aux tanks to ensure MTOW could not carry enough to remain up that long.

[llondel]

I think it would be refuelled by tanker during that week. The endurance is probably based on the amount of food on board.

[Boac]

Most 'long duration' flights are also limited by consumables such as oils.

[Wodrick]

Silly me never thought of in flight refuelling for a 747

[Pontius Navigator]

In the Cold War a Looking Glass 135 was launched from Offutt AFB every day for a continuous airborne command post. The minimum ranking officer on board was a SAC one star in rotation from around the Command.

In case of bad weather at Offutt a tanker would keep it airborne longer. I am not sure how long a routine flight was, maybe 24 hrs.

[Mrs Ex-Ascot]

Wouldn't it be more practical to hide from run any potential nasty war from a well built underground bunker rather than fly around in a potential airborne target ?

[ian16th]

Wouldn't it be more practical to hide from run any potential nasty war from a well built underground bunker rather than fly around in a potential airborne target ?

If airborne at the time of the trouble starting, one might need to stumble around whilst working out which way to go!

[Undried Plum]

I remember hearing/reading that the limitation is the engine oil. They have extra large oil tanks in them thar engines, but there is some plumbing reason why it's not practical to rig a top-up while the donks are running.

[Pontius Navigator]

I have an idea that the B36 was so large that the FE could go into the wing. May be bollocks but it was big.

[ian16th]

I remember hearing/reading that the limitation is the engine oil. They have extra large oil tanks in them thar engines, but there is some plumbing reason why it's not practical to rig a top-up while the donks are running.

This has been a problem with IFR/AAR since Alan Cobham was a lad!

IFR/AAR is by and large a military endeavour. Even though Sir Alan envisaged it as a means to service the Empire with none stop civilian flights to India.

A lot of military use is simply to increase pay load at take off, where an a/c takes off with a full weapons load but low on fuel, once airborne topping up the fuel to a number above MTOW. This is common with naval ops from carriers.

In all of these cases oil consumption doesn't normally come into the consideration.

[Boac]

It may have been the Buccaneer, but one mil a/c was quite limited by oil consumption. I was not aware of any limit for the Lightning and we often did 6:30+.

[ian16th]

It may have been the Buccaneer, but one mil a/c was quite limited by oil consumption. I was not aware of any limit for the Lightning and we often did 6:30+.

The Lightning had Avon's, the same as the Valiant, albeit without after burner.

For the non-stop flight UK to Singapore they kept operating for 15 hours 35 minutes.

[Alisoncc]

Perhaps the UK could sell the septics the Blackburn Beverley technology. Wherein engine oil is sprayed continuously on the outside of the engine cowlings, with the expectation that it would soak through.

[ian16th]

Blackburn Beverley first flight 20 June 1950

Lockheed C-130 Hercules first flight 23 August 1954

[Boac]

I was told that navigation on the Beverley return leg was always made easier by the trail of oil.

[ricardian]

Perhaps the UK could sell the septics the Blackburn Beverley technology. Wherein engine oil is sprayed continuously on the outside of the engine cowlings, with the expectation that it would soak through.

Fans of the Beverley

[Ex-Ascot]

Perhaps the UK could sell the septics the Blackburn Beverley technology. Wherein engine oil is sprayed continuously on the outside of the engine cowlings, with the expectation that it would soak through.

Fans of the Beverley

Thought I heard the dulcet tones of Mike Westwood there before he made an appearance. We used to para drop together and he was a flight commander on 10 Sqn before my time. Now Chairman of The 10 Sqn Association. I am still in contact with him.