BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

A place to discuss politics and things related to Govts

Do you think the UK leaving the European Union would be a good thing?

Poll ended at Sat Jun 18, 2016 8:51 pm

Yes
36
72%
No
14
28%
 
Total votes: 50

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Krystal n Chips
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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2441 Post by Krystal n Chips » Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:06 am

Capetonian wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:55 pm
It's all coming unravelled at the seams, just as many forecast it would. The self-destruct seems to be gathering momentum.
An influential economic research centre has warned that 100,000 jobs could be put at risk in Germany if the UK leaves the EU without securing a deal.

The study by the Halle Institute for Economic Research found that jobs in the car industry would be particularly vulnerable to the uncertainties created by Britain tumbling out of the EU without securing a favourable trading relationship.

Export giant Germany sold 770,000 vehicles to the UK in 2017 and 15,000 jobs in its automobile sector are reliant on this huge level of trade.

The study estimates that Wolfsburg, hometown of Volkswagen, would be hit hardest by a collapse in exports that would result from a no-deal exit.
Italy is drawing up emergency plans to safeguard financial stability and keep trade with the UK flowing even if there is a no-deal Brexit, if necessary through a bilateral deal between Rome and London.

The country’s insurgent Lega-Five Star coalition is increasingly worried that a mishandling of the EU’s Brexit crisis could push Italy's fragile economy into a dangerous downward slide and risk a funding crisis for its sovereign debt at a treacherous moment.

Premier Giuseppe Conte has told his Brexit Task Force to focus urgently on ports, airports, customs, and the handling of food trade, as well as the status of Italians living in the UK.
And the source of the above is ?.....it generally helps if a link to a source is provided...in case some "selective editing " has taken place which conveniently ignores the rest of the content.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2442 Post by FD2 » Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:45 am

Number 5,347 in an unending series:

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europ ... n-industry

Oh dear, how sad, never mind.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2443 Post by Boac » Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:18 am

"And the source of the above is" - maybe the Telegraph?

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2444 Post by Krystal n Chips » Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:40 pm

Boac wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:18 am
"And the source of the above is" - maybe the Telegraph?
Thank you. A verifiable source is all it takes....otherwise it could simply be cut and pasted from a variety of sources. Plus, I'm not inclined to go scouring every right wing website in the hope of finding the origin.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2445 Post by nomorecatering » Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:36 pm

There are many ways to shore up confidence in having made the right choice. One of them is to point at others at say it's going to be worse for you than me.
What is probably lost on the pointer is that it shows not much confidence at all.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2446 Post by Pontius Navigator » Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:46 pm

It also shows that their worse gives you a competitive advantage.

But bad for me, worse for you also points out the truism that the whole is more effective than the sum of the parts.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2447 Post by OFSO » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:04 pm

If you'll allow me to comment from the other side of La Manche (only for a few days more, thank God) and as one who reads and/or watches Frog, Kraut and Woppo media, I can tell you that France, German and Italian industry is extremely concerned at the prospect of a 'No deal' Brexit and as fed up with the intransigent posturing of 'Brussels' as the British are. The big exception out of those countries with which I am intimately familiar is Spain, which unreported by the rest of Europe's media is more concerned with trying to decide to what level of fascism they will descend after April's General Election and when to send the Army in to sieze Gibraltar. (Not joking, please note).

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2448 Post by Pontius Navigator » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:15 pm

Last time they did that we sent a battle flight: two Hunters. Today, two Typhoon, and a CVS with F35, or a couple of Hawks?

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2449 Post by Krystal n Chips » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:32 am

OFSO wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:04 pm
If you'll allow me to comment from the other side of La Manche (only for a few days more, thank God) and as one who reads and/or watches Frog, Kraut and Woppo media, I can tell you that France, German and Italian industry is extremely concerned at the prospect of a 'No deal' Brexit and as fed up with the intransigent posturing of 'Brussels' as the British are. The big exception out of those countries with which I am intimately familiar is Spain, which unreported by the rest of Europe's media is more concerned with trying to decide to what level of fascism they will descend after April's General Election and when to send the Army in to sieze Gibraltar. (Not joking, please note).
Your introductory line suggested you have been reading the overseas editions of the Mail....but then you mentioned Spain.

Being thick, I had a search and found this article.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ews-brexit


The views expressed clearly reflect on the UK, and Treeza, et al, but in there is a link to Spain and the rise of the far right. Reading that article is, as you say. more than disturbing because of the implications and damage the far right will inflict if they ever gain a serious level of political influence.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... h-politics

However, it was nice to read that the coned headed robe wearing racists "God Bless America Sir / Ma'am "! have taken a interest, won't be long before Tommy gets a call I suppose with his expertise in these matters, but, there does seem to be a common feature that attracts the alt.right.....prancing around on a horse !.....Eugene was fond of this display of equestrian power imagery his supporters will nostalgically recall.....until the day said horse dumped him back on the ground.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2450 Post by Magnus » Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:56 am

Spain is probably rather more concerned with the Catalan separatists and the potential loss of income for Madrid should the Catalans get their way.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2451 Post by OFSO » Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:01 pm

True. 28% of Spain's income from one autonomous area. But not autonomous much longer. Whoever gets in will crush the decent & hard working Catalans. As well as the State v. Catalan politicians trial (sentences up to 30 years) the political Vox Party is bringing a private case and demanding 75 years imprisonment for each member of the Catalan government. If the death sentence was still in the books, Vox would demand the death penalty. Never underestimate the cruelty of the Spanish.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2452 Post by Krystal n Chips » Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:16 am

For those who are so obsessed with leaving, and a "no deal....cos we can dictate our terms to the EU afterwards, so there "!, feel free to superimpose, or photo-shop images, of yourselves over those depicted.....

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ks-cartoon

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2453 Post by Capetonian » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:51 pm

Britain could lead the world into a new era of democracy and free trade, using the Brexit revolt against the establishment as a springboard to making the global order more cooperative, accountable and prosperous, according to the Governor of the Bank of England.

The current system of global trade has key flaws including wealth and income inequality, a lack of democracy and trust, and serious financial imbalances, Mark Carney warned on Tuesday.

However, in a sharp departure from the Governor's "project fear" warnings of the past three years, Mr Carney said Brexit has the potential to address these issues and provide the opportunity to create a new way of running the world.
He's changed his tune, I suppose someone else is pulling his strings this week.
One thing you can say for the French, when civilization falls they have less far to fall than everyone else.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2454 Post by Pontius Navigator » Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:00 pm

I sense someone has let the pink pigs out early.

Britain could lead the world into a new era of democracy and free trade, using the Brexit revolt against the establishment as a springboard to making the global order more cooperative, accountable and prosperous, according to the Governor of the Bank of England.

With our current crop of world crass politicians?

The current system of global trade has key flaws including wealth and income inequality, a lack of democracy and trust, and serious financial imbalances, Mark Carney warned on Tuesday.

no *sh*t* Sherlock

However, in a sharp departure from the Governor's "project fear" warnings of the past three years, Mr Carney said Brexit has the potential to address these issues and provide the opportunity to create a new way of running the world.

Potential, a wonderful word

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2455 Post by nomorecatering » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:43 pm

Pontius Navigator wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:46 pm
the whole is more effective than the sum of the parts.
That is rejected as "Project Fear" by the pointers while they happily accept any negative predictions for the remaining 27.

It is quite the dissonance and self-deception.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2456 Post by Pontius Navigator » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:18 pm

The converse it also valid: the individual can be more nimble than the committee.

In NATO accepted doctrine is doctrine accepted by all members except they have a get out clause. At the beginning of the document will be listed exceptions, exemptions, and variations. A new document may be issued but it's predecessor remains in effect until some time in the future.

Far too simple for the EU

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2457 Post by ricardian » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:45 pm

BREXIT EXPLAINED
The Brussels Golf Club
Mr Dave Davis is at the golf club returning his locker key when Mr Barnier, the membership secretary sees him.
"Hello Mr Davis", says Mr Barnier. "I'm sorry to hear you are no longer renewing your club membership, if you would like to come to my office we can settle your account".
"I have settled my bar bill" says Mr Davis..
"Ah yes Mr Davis", says Mr Barnier, "but there are other matters that need settlement"
In Mr Barniers office.
Mr Davis explains that he has settled his bar bill so wonders what else he can possibly owe the Golf Club?
"Well Mr Davis" begins Mr Barnier, "you did agree to buy one of our Club Jackets".
"Yes" agrees Mr Davis "I did agree to buy a jacket but I haven't received it yet. As soon as you supply the jacket I will send you a cheque for the full amount".
"That will not be possible" explains Mr Barnier. "As you are no longer a club member you will not be entitled to buy one of our jackets"!
"But you still want me to pay for it" exclaims Mr Davis.
"Yes" says Mr Barnier, "That will be £500 for the jacket. There is also your bar bill".
"But I've already settled my bar bill" says Mr Davis. "Yes" says Mr Barnier, "but as you can appreciate, we need to place our orders from the Brewery in advance to ensure our bar is properly stocked. You regularly used to spend at least £50 a week in the bar so we have placed orders with the brewery accordingly for the coming year. You therefore owe us £2600 for the year".
"Will you still allow me to have these drinks?" asks Mr Davis.
"No of course not Mr Davis". "You are no longer a club member!" says Mr Barnier.
"Next is your restaurant bill" continues Mr Barnier. “In the same manner we have to make arrangements in advance with our catering suppliers. Your average restaurant bill was in the order of £300 a month, so we'll require payment of £3600 for the next year".
"I don't suppose you'll be letting me have these meals either" asks Mr Davis.
"No, of course not" says an irritated Mr Barnier, "you are no longer a club member!"
"Then of course" Mr Barnier continues, "there are repairs to the clubhouse roof".
"Clubhouse roof" exclaims Mr Davis, "What's that got to do with me?"
"Well it still needs to be repaired and the builders are coming in next week", your share of the bill is £2000".
"I see" says Mr Davis, "anything else?".
"Now you mention it" says Mr Barnier, "there is Fred the Barman's pension. We would like you to pay £5 a week towards Fred's pension when he retires next month. He's not well you know so I doubt we'll need to ask you for payment for longer than about five years, so £1300 should do it. This brings your total bill to £10,000" says Mr Barnier.
"Let me get this straight" says Mr Davis, "you want me to pay £500 for a jacket you won't let me have, £2600 for beverages you won't let me drink and £3600 for food you won't let me eat, all under a roof I won't be allowed under and not served by a bloke who's going to retire next month!"
"Yes, it's all perfectly clear and quite reasonable" says Mr Barnier.
"Get lost !" says Mr Davis
Now we understand what Brexit is all about!!!!!
No wonder Mrs May is having problems
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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2458 Post by Krystal n Chips » Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:50 pm

Sumz4begunners.

Me an maffs never really got on...heaven knows those kgs / litres / US gallons... and a special mention for the backward RAF using Imperial lbs in case they feel left out...... were always a source of confusion ...when trying to work out how much petrol was in before I put some more in ..and that's before the further complexity of SG got involved.....so perhaps our resident mathematicians / trade and economics analysts on here could explain this mere £101bn discrepancy ......

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... e-deals-eu

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2459 Post by OFSO » Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:54 pm

Only one person on this thread is 'obsessed' with Brexit//leaving the EU. The rest of us normals are just wondering how it will turn out and hoping something good will come out of it for all concerned.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2460 Post by Pontius Navigator » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:13 pm

OFSO, unlike TOP where opposites are implacable and neither prepared to concede a point. Both air positioning to say I told you so.

And in the real world my share portfolio continues to defy gravity. I read, yesterday I think, that the City is now working beyond Brexit.

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