BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

A place to discuss politics and things related to Govts

Do you think the UK leaving the European Union would be a good thing?

Poll ended at Sat Jun 18, 2016 8:51 pm

Yes
36
72%
No
14
28%
 
Total votes: 50

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FD2
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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2481 Post by FD2 » Sun Feb 17, 2019 3:49 am

Sad business for those concerned, but it seems it's all the fault of Brexit:

https://www.scotsman.com/news/transport ... -1-4874347

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2482 Post by llondel » Sun Feb 17, 2019 4:37 am

...the latter arising from the EU’s recent decision to exclude UK airlines from full participation in the Emissions Trading Scheme.
Interesting bit there. Why were they excluded? I can see that if the UK had sought an opt-out for some reason then it makes sense, but if it's because of Brexit then surely that shouldn't take effect until the end of March. Too many things are being conveniently blamed on Brexit when, on closer examination, it's just a convenient excuse and avoids the real culprits carrying the can. I guess we can expect anything bad that happens in the next five years to be solely due to Brexit and absolutely nothing to do with mistakes and errors of judgement or other world events.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2483 Post by Krystal n Chips » Sun Feb 17, 2019 7:18 am

Many of you will approve of Gav, Private Pike to others, because he's just the sort of gung ho Defence Secretary the nation needs....so plenty of medals and parades to be had if he got his way and dispatched UK forces hither and thither across the globe to project our "lethality "......damned good chap Gav !....ignoring the fact the bulk of the population wouldn't share his enthusiasm of course.

Which leads to trade deals, or rather the paucity of such.....this won't cause any hardship as we know, at least in the minds of those convinced the Empire over which the sun never sets, is about to emerge again. Here's Pike kindly helping to ensure the UK remains firmly below the glideslope, off track. and below fuel minimums on a Cat 3 approach......

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... tive-anger

Some more inconvenient, and therefore will be simply ignored, facts about trade deals....

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... als-brexit

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2484 Post by compo » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:24 am

Ah yes, Gav's version of the opium wars seem to be going as well as can be expected.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2485 Post by Magnus » Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:28 pm

I see the dopey bint occupying #10 is asking for MPs to "put aside their personal preferences" and support her. Perhaps if SHE'D put aside her personal preferences and support the 17.5 million who want a break from the EU, we wouldn't be in the fekn mess we are. No deal for me, thanks.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2486 Post by Krystal n Chips » Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:00 pm

That's just typical of those foreign types....fancy not just letting the UK get what it demands !.....and even better, the communication skills so reminiscent of the Empire days.....

Of course, this may have no bearing on our ability to negotiate from a position of weakness once we have left the EU..how could it when the Japanese were clearly in the wrong in the first place !

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... eremy-hunt


And now, it's ??.......Sayonara Swindon......

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2487 Post by BenThere » Mon Feb 18, 2019 4:07 pm

Krystal, what's so wrong with the UK making its own trade arrangements, unbound by EU constraints? UK inventiveness, industrial resources, intellectual achievement, and so much more would portend a realization of prosperity far above the sclerotic constraints of the EU, with its overwhelming desire to preserve the status quo of Germany and France, two moribund societies.

I want to see the UK skyrocket in the next generation. That will only happen with independence.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2488 Post by llondel » Mon Feb 18, 2019 4:59 pm

The trouble with the remain types is that they all assume the UK will be in a position of weakness post-Brexit. Look at it another way - if the UK doesn' t have something that someone wants then a trade deal is not required. Otherwise there is bargaining power.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2489 Post by Capetonian » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:08 pm

Krystal, what's so wrong with the UK making its own trade arrangements, unbound by EU constraints?
What's wrong with it is that socialism is about control, centralisation, brain washing, and reducing everyone to the same level of poverty. The idealogy is inherently opposed to creativity, freedom, independence, and success. Not to mention a virulent and jealous loathing of prosperity.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2490 Post by Krystal n Chips » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:29 pm

BenThere wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 4:07 pm
Krystal, what's so wrong with the UK making its own trade arrangements, unbound by EU constraints? UK inventiveness, industrial resources, intellectual achievement, and so much more would portend a realization of prosperity far above the sclerotic constraints of the EU, with its overwhelming desire to preserve the status quo of Germany and France, two moribund societies.

I want to see the UK skyrocket in the next generation. That will only happen with independence.
In theory there is nothing wrong with the UK wishing to make our own trade deals. Unfortunately, the rest of the globe isn't too enthused about entering into deals with a country which has just decided it wants to leave a prominent trading bloc after some 43 years, with well established deals, links, relationships and trading partners in order to revert to the days, long since past thankfully, when the UK was at the centre of an Empire.

The success of those tasked with negotiating these future deals is best summated in one word.....minimal. There is, and always will be, a consummate arrogance amongst some of the UK demographic who consider themselves as the elite and their dealings with other nationalities reflect this arrogance.

The EU has benefitted the UK and vice versa. The relationship may not be quite serendipity personified, but, it's most certainly symbiotic.

I am intrigued as to why you define German and French societies as moribund, my experience being they are anything but.

Finally, on the subject of trade deals, the last thing I want is for the UK to become immersed in a one way Trump inspired "deal " with America . We have more than enough deals and influences from the States as it is, and the prospect of deals involving food supplies in particular fills me with alarm given the lower standards that prevail.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2491 Post by Capetonian » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:49 pm

For once a K&C post which makes sense, and with which I can find a few points of agreement, although I would question this:
Unfortunately, the rest of the globe isn't too enthused about entering into deals with a country which has just decided it wants to leave a prominent trading bloc.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2492 Post by Undried Plum » Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:01 pm

I'm trying very hard to think of a British PM who was such a failure in handling the core issue of his prime ministership.

Ted Heath? Perhaps, but only if you judge him solely on his inability to whack the miners. He could point to his success in bringing the UK into the Common Market which really was a huge achievement at the time.

John Major? He was a wally, but he was successful in dragging the UK into the Maastricht thing and he delivered a surprising GE victory for his party. He also laid the groundwork for the Northern Ireland peace agreement for which he gets rather too little credit.

I think the last **** of a PM on the scale of Mrs May was Anthony Eden - and that was two-thirds of a century ago.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2493 Post by OFSO » Mon Feb 18, 2019 8:25 pm

Well. Macron is sitting in his ivory tower while France falls to pieces under him. Sanchez has pissed all his coilition partners off at the same time and is caretaking until the emergency general election: the 2019 Budget won't be passed until May at the earliest. Italy ? Greece ?

From a European perspective May is just one, but possibly the top-of-the-list, of incompetent 'leaders'.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2494 Post by Krystal n Chips » Tue Feb 19, 2019 8:05 am

Ah yes, now why should the immortal last lines uttered by Michael Caine come to mind.......along with the soundtrack ...

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ty-cartoon

Anyway, to answer Caco's suggestion, and to refute the risible suggestion Sayonara Swindon has nothing to do with Brexit.....astute readers will note the words "uncertainty "...and, the useful to have bit about tariffs and the EU.....there may be a correlation here.....plus other motor manufacturers getting an honourable mention, here's a helpful link......

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... se-in-2021

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2495 Post by Nick Riviera » Tue Feb 19, 2019 12:04 pm

Krystal n Chips wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 8:05 am
and to refute the risible suggestion Sayonara Swindon has nothing to do with Brexit
Rather than a link to that rag perhaps a quote from somebody close to the action would be better:

Ian Howells, senior vice-president for Honda in Europe, told the BBC: "We're seeing unprecedented change in the industry on a global scale. We have to move very swiftly to electrification of our vehicles because of demand of our customers and legislation.

"This is not a Brexit-related issue for us, it's being made on the global-related changes I've spoken about.

"We've always seen Brexit as something we'll get through, but these changes globally are something we will have to respond to. We deeply regret the impact it will have on the Swindon community."

Mr Howells said that, in the light of changes in the industry, the company had to "look very closely" at where it was putting its investment. "It has to be in a marketplace of a size for Honda, where it makes investment worthwhile.

"The conclusion coming out of that is that that doesn't include Swindon - the relative size of the marketplace in Europe is significantly different."

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2496 Post by Magnus » Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:38 pm

Krystal and Karl begin with the same letter. Coincidence?

The Beeb has long been of the remain persuasion, but even they had to report this morning that:
Honda said the move was due to global changes in the car industry and the need to launch electric vehicles, and it had nothing to do with Brexit.
Not quite the risible suggestion you claimed, eh?

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2497 Post by Capetonian » Tue Feb 19, 2019 5:01 pm

Magnus : You are being very cruel, using facts to refute Komrad Krystal's 'argument'.

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2498 Post by OFSO » Tue Feb 19, 2019 5:07 pm

And as for the political situation......

Currently lowest UK unemployment level since 1975 at 4% . Spain 28% .

Average UK wage £2000 per month. Average Spanish wage €998.

Look to Windward....

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2499 Post by Krystal n Chips » Tue Feb 19, 2019 5:08 pm

Magnus wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:38 pm
Krystal and Karl begin with the same letter. Coincidence?

The Beeb has long been of the remain persuasion, but even they had to report this morning that:
Honda said the move was due to global changes in the car industry and the need to launch electric vehicles, and it had nothing to do with Brexit.
Not quite the risible suggestion you claimed, eh?
Actually, even more so if you condescend to read this article.......feel free to explain why any organisation would happily pay tariffs when the option of not paying them will become available thanks to ?......a trade deal with ?....the EU !...... and, the complex bit I know, but, which country is currently in the EU, but won't be after March 2019 ?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... se-in-2021

Your embryonic career as a conspiracy theorist is also doomed to failure....the "K" was a piss take rather than the "C"....alas, in contrast, the "M" opens up endless possible suggestions.......

Nearly forgot....another trivial detail....apart from the direct job losses, there's also those in the generic termed " supply chain "..2nd / 3rd / 4th tiers who both directly and indirectly are dependant on the factory for work.

Still, the good news ! No more hold ups on the A417 and.....all those fruit and veg picking vacancies induced by the disappearance of those nasty immigrants will be filled by redundant workers as mentioned above !......Booming post Brexit Britain has nothing to fear for the future prosperity ! ( please enter the Pathe News soundtrack at your convenience at this point )

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Re: BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

#2500 Post by Magnus » Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:27 pm

The parenthesised phrase in your penultimate paragraph was unnecessary as we've come to expect trivia from you. Care to address OFSO's points? Highest employment levels ever in the UK, wages outstripping inflation, UK economy growing faster than Germany, France or, of course, the PIIGS economies. Must be that bloody Brexit dragging us into the mire.

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