BREXIT - A Poll & Discussion

[FD2]

Don't try to confuse the issue with facts - dogma, dire alarmist stories plus Guardian quotes and are needed for any meaningful argument. Any so called 'facts' can be discarded as mere distractions from the march to a great and glorious socialist future.

[OFSO]

The EU car export trade to the USA is worth fifty billion dollars a year: of this, Germany exports 500,000 vehicles.

Trump is proposing raising the import tariff on EU sourced vehicles from 2.5% to 25% .

And you think Germany is worried (only) about Brexit ?

Source: today's 'Times' page 30. (US/German relations at a new low.)

[G-CPTN]

Don't the German manufacturers build cars in the USA?

German automakers sold 1.35 million vehicles in the United States in 2017, about 8% of total US car sales. Of those, only 494,000 were exported from Germany to the United States,
Most of the remainder were made in the United States and in Mexico, which has a free trade agreement with the United States.

[Nick Riviera]

Allow me to translate our Marxist's latest offering:

"I have been proved wrong (yet again) but I am not man enough to admit it. I will instead write another meaningless diatribe to try and distract from the fact of my permanent state of ignorance."

[Krystal n Chips]

Allow me to translate our Marxist's latest offering:

"I have been proved wrong (yet again) but I am not man enough to admit it. I will instead write another meaningless diatribe to try and distract from the fact of my permanent state of ignorance."

Nick..I don't know what your retirement plans are, but, they could well receive a boost to funding if you sued the local authority responsible for your education....you appear to have an incontrovertible claim after all.

Anyway, to err is human as they say,and sometimes I do make mistakes ...on the basis of being human, but, not in this instance.

https://www.ft.com/content/8c32704c-344 ... 2a211d90d5

Employment got a mention....and some rapturous joy resulted because the figures suggest all is going top hole, spiffingly well ( I like to use a vocabulary that the chaps and chums, being better educated that wot I iz ) can easily comprehend.....until, that is, we take a closer examination. of these figures.

Governments , of either hue, have always been very adept as to how they collate and subsequently present the data to the electorate....the exception being the unlamented deceased who saw just short of 3m as being a glowing testimony to her policies...because figures are easily understood. However, it's the context of jobs that doesn't get mentioned....part- time, gig economy, zero hours and short term contracts for example....and something called the underlying unemployment rate...this gets quite complex actually so I suggest some of you do your own research here and all will be revealed.

Currently, being ( just ) still in the EU the insidious effects of leaving have yet to fully emerge and within those effects is something called a recession....so for those currently over enthused as to how the UK is "booming "...jobs aplenty !, wages now paying for scrummy dining.... with change ! I suggest you come back in less than a year when reality will have started to make an impact on the current figures and your own selfish standards of living.

[Nick Riviera]

Latest translation:

"Somebody has called me out over being blatantly incorrect. I still am not man enough to admit that so I will pen yet another tedious diatribe. Of course I will start with a personal attack. Then I will drone on about something not related to the subject about which I was so wrong (pick pretty much any subject here). In short, perfect adherence to the Marxist playbook. How clever I am."

[Krystal n Chips]

Presumably, "our man in Japan " spent his time simply eating sushi and drinking green tea, so his views can be dismissed in the same casual manner as my own....

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... vid-warren

[Nick Riviera]

Latest translation:

"I can't seem to deflect from the facts of the point in question. However, the rag that tells me how to think has found a man who used to live in Japan and he agrees with me. He has no connection to Honda but that doesn't matter. Surely now everyone will see that I am right."

[Capetonian]

Pound Sterling was the best-performing major currency heading into the mid-week session, rallying as markets sense potential movement in Brexit negotiations.

I am sure our Marxist will dismiss this as lies.
He would hate to know that I've just made a few hundred quid on the strength of sterling.

[OFSO]

Indeed. Just going to pop to the PC and do a bit of trading myself.

[Krystal n Chips]

And as for the political situation......

Currently lowest UK unemployment level since 1975 at 4% . Spain 28% .

Average UK wage £2000 per month. Average Spanish wage €998.

Look to Windward....

Well quite...here's a sterling example of economic success to support the UK's future .....

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... -thinktank

[Capetonian]

Well quite...here's a sterling example of economic success to support the UK's future .....

True meaning:
"Here's yet another link I've dredged up to a Guardian article supporting my 'project fear' theory of Brexit."
Carry on pissing into the wind, Krystal. It was funny until it got so boringly predictable.

Of course you will conveniently dismiss news such as this:

Record budget surplus strengthens Philip Hammond's hand ahead of Brexit.

Don't worry though, everybody is out of step except you.

[Krystal n Chips]

Well quite...here's a sterling example of economic success to support the UK's future .....

True meaning:
"Here's yet another link I've dredged up to a Guardian article supporting my 'project fear' theory of Brexit."
Carry on pissing into the wind, Krystal. It was funny until it got so boringly predictable.

Of course you will conveniently dismiss news such as this:

Record budget surplus strengthens Philip Hammond's hand ahead of Brexit.

Don't worry though, everybody is out of step except you.

Yes I know, absolutely soopah news ! ....sightings of unicorns on Salisbury plain and the Cotswolds now confirmed in our booming economy !.....apart from these inconveniences.....

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... n-operator

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47315538

[Magnus]

It's terribly inconvenient to report a 15% increase in profits. After the Brexit vote. Oh, woe is me.

[Krystal n Chips]

It's terribly inconvenient to report a 15% increase in profits. After the Brexit vote. Oh, woe is me.

Impressive.....well it would be if you had actually included a source and whom this percentage is applicable to....

[Capetonian]

The truth is never palatable, unless of course it comes from the Guardian.

[BenThere]

If I read you right, Krystal, I think you are on the side of spreading, rather than accumulating wealth - equalization being your objective.

My take is that Brexit favors accumulation, while Remaining favors redistribution. I believe the UK would do better making its own way, unleashing the inherent capacity for Brits to figure out ways to better themselves on their own. I also think the current US government is friendlier to an independent UK, though that could change if the current US administration changes in 2020. You take your chances.

I'm hopeful UK and other EU members will reject the smothering and unaccountable methods of the EU to facilitate open immigration, welfare state, and protectionist policy in favor of the proven dynamics of Capitalism. If they don't the future, I think, is continuing decline, or at best stagnation. UK has wisely voted to disengage from this. I hope the voters succeed in saving their country.

[Magnus]

KnC, the source was your own link to the beeb in #2509.

Last year, the investment bank reported a 15% increase in profits to £2.6bn.

Do you often post links in support of what passes for your arguments without actually READING and understanding them?

[OFSO]

Corbyn flew to Madrid today for consolation from the Spanish socialist Prime Minister, Sanchez. Amazingly he appeared not to have been informed that after less than a year in power, Sanchez has lost his majority and been forced to call a general election on April 27th. Predictions are that a right plus far-right government will takeover.

[Krystal n Chips]

If I read you right, Krystal, I think you are on the side of spreading, rather than accumulating wealth - equalization being your objective.

My take is that Brexit favors accumulation, while Remaining favors redistribution. I believe the UK would do better making its own way, unleashing the inherent capacity for Brits to figure out ways to better themselves on their own. I also think the current US government is friendlier to an independent UK, though that could change if the current US administration changes in 2020. You take your chances.

I'm hopeful UK and other EU members will reject the smothering and unaccountable methods of the EU to facilitate open immigration, welfare state, and protectionist policy in favor of the proven dynamics of Capitalism. If they don't the future, I think, is continuing decline, or at best stagnation. UK has wisely voted to disengage from this. I hope the voters succeed in saving their country.

Apologies for the delay in replying. Real life takes priority over a website, albeit some on here appear to have no knowledge of the former.

Correct, I am, being a socialist and having a social conscience, in favour of redistribution of wealth in the UK. Currently this is decidedly skewed as you can see.

https://www.equalitytrust.org.uk/scale- ... quality-uk

The UK is not in a position to become independent in the manner you suggest. The term "globalisation " and "global markets " have a relevance here and the UK cannot stand alone under the delusion the globe will decide we have the influence to usurp other economies.

The current US administration is, and this takes some doing, currently even more dysfunctional than the current UK Gov't. Trump's only friend is the promotion of "Brand Trump "..which he does with consummate ease, but he's no friend of the UK or anywhere else in the world creating as he is, isolation of America which is detrimental to Americans per se

The EU does not "smother ", it integrates and this integration is pivotal to retaining the trading bloc the EU has become.

Immigration. Always an emotive topic and even more so when used as a cornerstone to convince the UK electorate as to how blatant lies can be presented as "facts ". It's been well established, that, the right wing media in the UK have concentrated on producing headlines and articles , the contents of which, have included falsifications, or rather complete lies, in support of antagonism towards immigrants. Whereas immigrants, do, in fact, make a positive contribution towards UK society.

I have yet to see any "proven dynamics " of capitalism that benefits the poorer demographics of UK society when the reverse is the case.

I essence, the UK, whilst still having some global influence, does not have the resources to stand alone in the world and the decision to leave the EU will only further serve to exacerbate a decline in our global standing in addition to the welfare , standards of living, personal economics ( you may be unaware of the spiralling levels of household debt in the UK ) and employment prospects for many which will be the insidious effects of leaving the EU.

Magnus.....35% reduction in sales......that's a bland statement with no reference as to what and whom and where.....and I've just made it up to illustrate the ineptitude of your own bland statement. I do read, and understand, the links I post. But when I read a figure, with no reference as to it's source, then it's no surprise, apart from to yourself, obviously, as to why anybody would question as to what this figure actually relates to. Could have been in the sale of quails eggs for all we knew.

But, some good news !

Rip off and Fleece ( Property Profiteers ) are delighted to announce a soon to be vacant property that will appeal to the most discerning clients. The property is located in a much sought after central London location convenient for all transport links. The property benefits from enhanced security features in addition to being an exclusive gated location. We anticipate great demand for this property which will become available in late May or shortly thereafter "