What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

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Rwy in Sight
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What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#1 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:08 am

People in Western Europe are facing an increasing number of attacks - it seems that is a monthly occurrence. So far the reaction is more of "United we stand" and "they will not beat us". I am wondering if these attacks are going to be considered a risk associated with living in a free society (and having a good time - since most of those attacks occurred when people are having fun like a night out or enjoying the fire works) or one day the people will ask their government to do something effective and drastic? I don't know what can be really effective and drastic so, for the discussion sake's, put anything you like.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#2 Post by Boac » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:17 am

I cannot see an easy solution to the spread of 'Islamic hate'. I would like to see a stronger stance against social media and the spreading of such - it is said that the Swedish man arrested had been publishing pro-Islamic stuff on Farcebook in 2013. Can such posts be outlawed? Is this too radical a step? As I have posted elsewhere here, I also think any sort of 'preaching' of hate should be outlawed and punished - and that includes those on the right preaching intolerance.

The other problem, RIS, is what do you 'stop'? Ban ANY immigration from any non-Christian country? The answer to your question is, I believe, unfortunately, yes, it is a risk of living in a free society. The military actions of the west will always foster hate somewhere, and the Trumpet has now abandoned his original 'principles' and is on the way to join the party.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#3 Post by Bob » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:34 am

The recent trend of mowing down crowds with motor vehicles is rather worrying, it's hard to see how you can stop this.
All in all I am pretty fed up with hearing the bleating apologists for Islam, none of them ever take any responsibility and it is increasingly clear that the Muslim communities in the west do as much to protect the extremists as they can.
Has anyone EVER heard of a terrorist being outed by fellow muslims?, I expect if it has ever happened then it has been kept under cover to protect the individual from reprisal attacks by his fellow peace lovers
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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#4 Post by Boac » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:48 am

Destructive and horrible for people as the recent motor vehicle attacks are, they are in fact pretty insignificant in the big picture of terrorist atrocities and perhaps we should be thankful that the 'terrorists' have been reduced to these levels.

Bob, I do not find, in my life, I am exposed to "the bleating apologists for Islam" - where is it that you are affected by this? If it is a few media outlets then perhaps these need to be 'leant on'. I certainly do not see them. I mostly see only condemnation.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#5 Post by Slasher » Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:02 am

I have a bag of nuts. About a thousand. Here, take 'em and eat!

What? Oh I don't know exactly where they're from. I think fifty are from the US, another twenty from South America and perhaps ten from Oz, but I'm not entirely sure. The rest I don't know and I have no documentation on their origin.

Here...eat!

Are they all good? I suppose so. Why wouldn't they be? They all look ok. Well...I concede looks aren't everything, perhaps there might be 2 or 3 that are highly poisonous and will kill you. But here...take the bag won't you? These nuts have had a bloody hard journey to get here. By all means screen and test them but don't let any bad ones slip by. And don't forget a very small number of seemingly good nuts can become poisonous and deadly for no apparent reason.

No? You reject the whole bag? You'll only risk eating nuts from your own orchard and similarly grown ones from elsewhere?

You bloody racist!

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#6 Post by Boac » Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:32 am

Are you on the right thread?

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#7 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:46 pm

Thanks BOAC for you answer. It does surprise me however that most offenders so far come from within rather than from the countries attacked by the west. May I point out however that if you exclude Iraq the other Western Interventions​ were made to get rid of a bad head of state - although many residents of Iraq would prefer the previous regime.

Slasher I see your point maybe I will pass my obligation to eat nuts.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#8 Post by Bob » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:34 pm

Bob, I do not find, in my life, I am exposed to "the bleating apologists for Islam" - where is it that you are affected by this


Every report containing interviews with Young Muslims living in Europe, I'm not sure if that meets your criteria:
I do not find, in my life, I am exposed to
, suppose I could just just turn it off and bury head in the sand, but I Can't seem to do that.
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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#9 Post by Boac » Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:03 pm

We watch different channels.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#10 Post by Alisoncc » Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:24 pm

RiS, are you are looking for constructive suggestions?

Hate crimes have been a part of society since the year dot. Members of one group have always been only too happy to kill members of the other. Paleolithics probably hated Neolithics. Romans the Barbarians. ......... Catholics and Protestants. Caucasian Americans versus Afro Americans. Right wing Christians v. Gays and Lesbians. So to with Muslim nutters. The media naming such incidents as being "Terrorist" related needs to stop. They are in simple terms HATE crimes.

Naming each incident as being terror related just attracts other nutters to the cause. If I were sufficiently aggrieved with the authorities and drove my car into a bunch of police or security personnel would it be a terror attack if I were to call out "Alan's Snackbar" as I did? I know I would get maximum publicity for my issues by doing so.

It's all about wedge politics. Seeking to split societies into it's disparate parts. Naming such attempts as terrorist related is playing into the hands of those practising such techniques. Note the extent to which the media go overboard when the word "terrorism" is mentioned, and it's plain rubbish.

If the recent Stockholm incident was reported as "Some f*cking nutter has driven a truck into pedestrians" would it have got as much publicity as it did? And more importantly would other nutters now be planning to do the same elsewhere.

It's not about Protestants, Catholics, Muslims, Sikhs, people with slant eyes or brown skins, left handed or right handed, those with blue eyes, or taller than 6 foot or those whose sexual preference is members of their own sex. It's just about some with an axe to grind, and it needs to be named as such. They are simply HATE crimes. End of story.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#11 Post by Boac » Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:51 pm

I quite agree, Alison. Let's drop this 'Terror' tag. After all, anyone trying to do me or my family in, with or without your 'Alan's Snackbar', is pretty terrifying.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#12 Post by ExSp33db1rd » Sat Apr 08, 2017 10:06 pm

A few years ago an "older" man accidentally drove his car into the pedestrians and shoppers at the weekly Street Market in Santa Monica, CA. It was a genuine, tragic, accident, something to do with getting his foot wedged twixt brake and accelerator ( I know, I know, but don't ask me now ) I guess if it happened again tomorrow he would be shot on sight and questions asked afterwards ?

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#13 Post by Bob » Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:48 am

Boac wrote:We watch different channels.


What Channel do you watch Boac?

Has anyone EVER heard of a terrorist being outed by fellow muslims?, I expect if it has ever happened then it has been kept under cover to protect the individual from reprisal attacks by his fellow peace lovers


????

All fundamentalists display the same behaviour, most Catholics I know still defend their abusers in the catholic schools they attended, only the very extreme cases get recognised for what they were and even then it takes decades for the victim to speak out
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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#14 Post by Boac » Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:59 am

Bob wrote:What Channel do you watch Boac?


BBC1&2, BBC News24, ITV, C4, Sky News, RT (UK) for starters. I see very very few "bleating apologists for Islam".

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#15 Post by OFSO » Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:31 am

most Catholics I know still defend their abusers

Very true. I have a good friend, American, a confirmed and faithful Catholic, who maintains that every instance of priests abusing children is an "isolated incident". Here in Spain, nominally a Catholic country, abuse by priests is just regarded as 'par for the course'.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#16 Post by obgraham » Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:26 am

I've seldom heard worse BS. I hang out with a lot of Catholics. Today is one of the days most important to the Faith. To a person, every practising Catholic I know is disgusted by the behavior of pervy priests, and extremely angry at their enabling bishops. I for one have had a rather unpleasant discussion with our own bishops to make my points.

What I don't do, however, is throw out the central beliefs because the human practitioners have fallen short. And I realize that on forums such as this, most of the participants follow your thoughts rather than mine, but that is irrelevant to me.

And get back to me when Catholics start driving trucks into crowds, throwing gays off buildings, and teaching their children to blow up pizza parlors.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#17 Post by OFSO » Sun Apr 09, 2017 12:18 pm

Hey obgraham, don't vent your rage at me. I mentioned one (1) Catholic friend and didn't say all Catholics. She also thinks Donald Trump is wonderful....

For the record we have had two Catholic priests at the Basillica in Castello d'Empurias and both were very much loved and respected by all the townspeople. Although as one local said to me "despite being priests" but that's a very Catalan attitude towards the church.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#18 Post by obgraham » Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:51 pm

Small world, OFSO.I've met that priest at Castello d'Empurias and had quite a nice discussion with him about the music program there. Wonderful man.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#19 Post by Cukup Sudah » Sun Apr 09, 2017 9:39 pm

OFSO wrote:most Catholics I know still defend their abusers

Wasn't it recently agreed here that that this penchant for little boys was a Muslim thing? Just as raping women was?

Anyhow, this thread is a good example of how people don't even know their most recent history. The number of terrorist attacks were far higher in the 70s and 80s, peaking in 1979 with more than 1000 attacks. If that has already faded from memory, then the current situation should be forgotten sometime next month.

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Re: What it will take for Europeans to say enough is enough?

#20 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:01 pm

Cukup Sudah, the nature of the terrorism was much different in the 70/80's and today. Back then, people might feel a bit of sympathy for the Palestinian cause to have a country although their issues with fellow Arabs were not negligible. However today I am fairly sure most Europeans don't want to support the ISIS cause at all. And as a secondary thought this distinction Palestinians vs ISIS makes any counter-measures difficult to implement.

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