Should we be more worried about plastic than global warming?

[probes]

Yep, but that's just bags. Microplastics (fluffy fleeces - gosh, I'd hate to give up these! to avoid the residue from washing machines) are far worse. And things that end up as plastic beaches.


Too comfy, too cheap? And mortally expensive in the long run.

[Capetonian]

Prince of Wales: I warned of plastic danger 40 years ago but was dismissed as 'out of touch'

1 November 2018 • 12:00am

The Prince of Wales said he warned about the dangers of plastic 40 years ago but was dismissed as ‘out of touch’ and ‘anti-science’

In an interview with Vanity Fair, the future monarch said he had felt uncomfortable putting his head ‘above the parapet’ in the 1970s, and said it ‘seemed to take forever’ for people to wake up to the danger of failing to protect the environment.

Ahead of his 70th birthday on November 14th, Prince Charles said he felt it was his duty to help find solutions to the problems facing humanity, including the crisis of plastic in the oceans and climate change.

“I don’t really see any value in saying, ‘I told you so’,” he said. “As a teenager I remember feeling deeply about this appallingly excessive demolition job being done on every aspect of life.

“In putting my head above the parapet on all these issues, and trying to remind people of their long-term, timeless relevance to our human experience - never mind trying to do something about them - I found myself in conflict with the conventional outlook which, as I discovered, is not exactly the most pleasant situation to find yourself.

“One of my duties has been to find solutions to vast challenges we face over accelerating climate change.

“However, it seems to take forever to alert people to the scale of the challenge. Over forty years ago I remember making a speech about the problems of plastic and other waste , but at that stage nobody was really interested and I was considered old-fashioned, out of touch and anti-science for warning of such things.”

Each year more than 380 million tons of plastic are produced globally and at least eight million tons ends up in the sea.

It is estimated that there is now a 1:2 ratio of plastic to plankton and, left unchecked, plastic will outweigh fish by 2050. Britons use 7.7bn single-use plastic water bottles a year and fewer than half are recycled, meaning that 16 million bottles are binned every day in the UK.

Earlier this year, the Prince said that although the plastic problem is ‘extremely grave’ and ‘unbelievably urgent’ he was encouraged that the issue was now on the global agenda and the public consciousness.

In the budget this week, Phillip Hammond, the Chancellor announced a new tax on plastics that cannot be recycled and the government is also consulting on banning plastic straws, stirrers and cotton buds.

And since the plastic bag charge was introduced in 2015, each Briton uses just 25 plastic bags a year compared to the 140 before the charge, which removes six billion bags from circulation each year.

But in the new interview, the Prince said there was still more to do.

“If we don’t engage with these issues, and many other related and critical problems that they inevitably compound, we will all be victims,” he added. “Nobody escapes.”

The November issue also features new images of the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall, photographed by Alexi Lubomirski, the photographer behind the engagement photos of the Duke and Duchess of Sussex.

[Cacophonix]

The old boy is right about many environmental issues and so wrong about many things medical, vide his support for homoeopathy.

He is slightly eccentric but a decent cove at heart methinks!

Caco

[Mrs Ex-Ascot]

This Guardian long read is well worth reading.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... difference

[Capetonian]

Thanks for that, most interesting and as is the case generally with the Guardian, very well-written and well-researched. I am tempted to 'support' them by yielding to their exhortations If everyone who reads our reporting, who likes it, helps to support it, our future would be much more secure. For as little as £1, you can support the Guardian – and it only takes a minute. Thank you.

Much as it goes against the grain to support a left-wing publication, I might do so. What do others think?

[Slasher]

No way Jose. While I do like the CNN and BBC wx reports (Beeb is better) if I catch it, as well as the odd superb documentary on BBC World, I'd never give a red cent to any of 'em if they asked for it. I never give nothin' to any left wing medium. The only thing I ever donate to is the Salvos in Oz and an orphanage down in BKK.

While that guardian article was good, there're plenty of Corbyn rabble who'll gladly shell out and support it.

[BenThere]

I agree that the Guardian is the best written and published expression of the radical Left viewpoint. I visit its website often and sometimes post on the comment board, but as Yogi Berra said, "Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded."

I wish we had a few dozen more posters here so as to have a broader conversation and exchange, but I do like this site's open forum and Alison's moderate moderating. Besides, they don't let me on TOP anymore.

Contribute to the Guardian? Hell, no! Aside from its excellent journalistic standards, it remains the enemy (of civilization).

[ExSp33db1rd]

For as little as £1, you can support the Guardian – and it only takes a minute.

Christmas Present from youngest son ... a year's sub. to the Guardian Weekly, just re-morphed as a colour magazine, a la "Time", but still needs a couple of days to read thoroughly !

[admin]

I wish we had a few dozen more posters here so as to have a broader conversation and exchange, but I do like this site's open forum and Alison's moderate moderating. Besides, they don't let me on TOP anymore.

Thank you. Knowing when to intervene and when not to doesn't come easy.

[BenThere]

Thank you, too, for what you do, Alison, to keep this site going.

I'm heading down to Mexico again for a couple of weeks. I've found that when I'm there it's easier to step back from the political frenzy and focus more on the enjoyment of life. Call it Margaritaville - works for me.

[Karearea]

Fwiw: In the late '70s or early '80s I bought from Trade Aid two jute shopping bags, made in Bangladesh I think.

One was stencilled with the words Jute Not Plastic - I think a Labrador got that one - and I still have the one stencilled Just Jute.

[Alisoncc]

Numerous reports of sperm whale washed up dead in Indonesia with 115 plastic cups in its guts. All up 6Kg of plastic was found. I suspect this won't become that uncommon, with whales and other sea mammals becoming extinct in that area due to plastic ingestion.

Alison

[BenThere]

Seems to me the focus of remediation efforts should be on 3rd world and socialist countries that seem to have little concern for such matters as environment and ecology. Their ideology seems to trump any sort of stewardship accountability.

I highly value the noble and great whales and sea mammals, along with the noble cats (lions and tigers), birds (eagles and falcons), and others, like the bears, wolves, foxes and such that have managed to survive over the human development of North America. Our mammal cousins are a treasure and must be protected from the encroachments of civilization. I will always vote for sensible preservation of species efforts. I do, though, oppose the destruction of California's central valley agricultural industry, which has fed the US for a long time, to preserve a little fish that means nothing to anybody.

[Alisoncc]

Seems to me the focus of remediation efforts should be on 3rd world and socialist countries that seem to have little concern for such matters as environment and ecology. Their ideology seems to trump any sort of stewardship accountability.

Ben, the US is the worlds largest producer and exporter of nurdles, the most common contaminant on most beaches worldwide. Nurdles are used in the production of plastic goods of all types.

Wikipedia offers a one line definition for nurdle: “A pre-production microplastic pellet about the size of a pea” Going to “microplastic,” Wiki continues: A large portion of marine debris consists of plastic particles, including nurdles, pre-production microplastic resin pellets typically under 5 mm (0.20 in) in diameter found outside of the typical plastic manufacturing stream and an intermediate good used to produce plastic final products; microbeads from cosmetics; and the breakdown products of plastic litter. Plastic particle water pollution is also referred to as mermaids' tears. Approximately 60 billion pounds (27 million tonnes of nurdles are manufactured annually in the United States. One pound of pelletized high-density polyethylene (HDPE) contains approximately 25,000 nurdles (approximately 20 mg per nurdle). (Wikipedia)

[Alisoncc]

Ben you wrote of Quintana Roo.

I don't think I'm getting close to tiring of a lobster lunch with a glass of Chilean sauvignon blanc at around $5, total tab. For dinner I can buy a whole red snapper or small grouper fresh off the boat for $4-5, toss it on the grill and handsomely feed us both.

A Case Study: A Tiny Remote Village with a Huge Global Problem!

Mahahual, a small fishing village in the Costa Maya Region in the State of Quintana Roo, is located next to the Sian Ka’an Biosphere Reserve and Xcalak National Reef Park : the major protected natural areas in the Mexican Caribbean.

Unfortunately, the southeast coast of the Yucatán Peninsula sits along the path of regional oceanic currents that act like an aquatic conveyor, carrying a steady stream of plastics garbage from the Caribbean, Central and South America, and elsewhere. The multiple origins of marine plastics pollution include land-based discharge, shipping, fishing boats, cruise ships, offshore military operations, and other sources: some intentional, some inadvertent. Mahahual then is the unwitting victim of mountains of plastics garbage from around the world.

http://www.bioquestsolutions.com/marine ... pollution/

Enjoy your seafood lunches and dinners, Ben. It's their problem not yours.

[BenThere]

I've volunteered my time many times to help clean up the beach at Akumal, the closest town to me in Quintana Roo. I'm a humble volunteer seaweed and plastic raker. It's a social event for me as I meet new friends doing it while feeling good about my contribution to the general welfare. The debris is mostly seaweed, but there are significant bits of plastic in it. I agree, plastic pollution is a menace, maybe the largest ecological threat facing humanity. My considered opinion is that we should focus more on that rather than waste our efforts on the chimera of climate change.

I'm inclined to think that the ultimate solution lies in more efficient recovery of plastic waste for incineration to extract the energy it can provide while removing plastic's deleterious effects from the ecosphere. As I see it, the big problem is that the economies of the world benefit more from using plastic than they pay to clean up for that use. We need to come up with a win-win solution for this serious problem.

One way we can help is to encourage paper/wood based packaging, which is generally easily burned, recyclable, and bio-degradable.

The Sian Ka'an reserve is magnificent. It's a huge area reserved to preserve pristine beach and jungle and allows exploration with minimal impact. It lies at the South end of Quintana Roo and runs to the Belize border. If you ever want to lose yourself in nature I recommend it. The area is also populated by ancient Mayans, who I've come to believe are the nicest, happiest people in the world, that I've come across, at least. You need an all wheel drive vehicle to do Sian Ka'an, and an adventurous spirit, but if you have the right outlook you will come out of there with utter awe.

[Mrs Ex-Ascot]

This is certainly a step in the right direction; https://news.sky.com/story/manufacturer ... e-11584427

[Mrs Ex-Ascot]

This is good news; https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... cheme.html

[Mrs Ex-Ascot]

I know this is from the DM, but there are some interesting points raised.https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... efore.html

Even here in Bots supermarkets are charging for plastic bags, making you ask for a bag and selling large bags made from recycled plastic. Unfortunately it is only the more enlightened people here who are making an effort to reduce plastic waste. But at least it is a start, and as this article highlights you are not going to change peoples habits overnight.

[ExSp33db1rd]

In NZ one supermarket chain went "single use" free a couple of months ago, viz the regular plastic bags used by the check out clerks, and the other w.e.f. Tuesday ( Jan 1st) so we now have to remember to take our own bags from the car when visiting the stores - I usually forget, put it all back in the trolley then throw it into various receptacles when I get to the car - and NZ nationwide is supposed to by "single use" free by July, so all retailers will have to find alternative packaging - forest depleting paper bags maybe ? - but ... the supermarkets still have dozens of rolls of plastic bags available in the vegetable aisle, to put your loose carrots, or sprouts, or potatos in, they just don't have the handy handles to help carry them by, but one can if one tries, and ...... the bakery shelves are full of cakes, biscuits, desserts etc. packed in large, hard shell plastic cases that only a 5 yr. old can open, as well ! They're only really playing at it, but it looks good for their publicity.

Also, wef. 1st January, our local Council recycling dumps, will only take plastic stuff marked re-cyclable grades 1 and 2, ( the numbers in the little triangles ) so the hard shell bakery covers, ice cream containers, and other plastic stuff will now have to go into the regular waste, for which there is a charge. I've already mentioned that some years ago the Council closed the town recycling centre, and we now have to go a great distance to get rid of it, and suddenly they wondered why they were spending 1,000's of dollars having to collect rubbish out of the local forests. ain't rocket science. I forecast that with the need to pay to recycle a lot of plastic again .... well you work it out. Meanwhile the supermarkets are claiming kudos for their "Lead" in reducing plastic bags.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against banishing plastic, but one has to be serious, not just play at it.