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I listened to the Boris presentation this evening, if that is the best the Tories can come up with then bring back the Whigs.

Johnson is an arse and will fail if selected as PM, the only good thing is that it will hasten a general election and the complete demise of the Conservative Party.

If you follow the news in the UK, you will hear repeated stories referring to various organizations that need 'better funding'. For that read ' more money '. Working from memory, in recent days, these have included:
Defence
Food banks
NHS
Schools
Prison Service
Public Transport
Research into cancer
Cycle paths
Film industry
Rail
One could go on and on.
The fact is that the pockets of government are not bottomless. It is the job of government to spend the tax pound in the best way possible bearing in mind that it is OUR money. Marxism has been demonstrated time and time again to be a system that simply does not function for the good of the people. What it does do, and quite successfully, is cause mainstream, capitalism to change its agenda to a more middle of the row path.

BenThere wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:43 pm

Venezuela just didn't do it right,

I'm an old man in my 80's, I've been hearing this excuse for failed paradises of socialism, for all of my years.

ian16th wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:15 pm

BenThere wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:43 pm

Venezuela just didn't do it right,

I'm an old man in my 80's, I've been hearing this excuse for failed paradises of socialism, for all of my years.

Ever lived in Norway? It has a quarter of the population, and less than a quarter of the oil reserves, of Venezuela, but is doing rather well as a socialist country.

The big difference is that Norway learned how to cringe to America's version of fascism, gracefully.

OFSO wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 12, 2019 7:30 am

Saw that Stewart chappie speaking on TV yesterday. Spoke very well. Either a good actor or very sincere. Understands that there's no more deal to be squozed out of Brussels. Interesting to listen to unlike the drone of the ghastly Maybore. He won't get it, but should.

It is very easy to underestimate Rory Stewart. I have have done so myself, to my chagrin.

I gave a talk on specialised subject material to a class at an obscure FCO school not far from Pompey. At the Q&A afterwards there stood up a wee slip of a boy, who looked like he was aged 13 and would be blown off his feet by a puff of a breeze. A face like a Capuchin monkey. Until he spoke, I thought he was a joke. A misfit in a class of very clever men of action. I was so wrong.

He asked the most extraordinarily insightful questions which showed that he had absorbed every detail of my talk and which went to a much more advanced level of understanding than any of the others of his class of very bright students. Not Smart Alec type questions, but ones which nevertheless displayed deeply intelligent thought and a thorough grasp of the complex subject(s) at hand.

At the end of the Q&A he took it upon himself to stand up and lead a vote of thanks of the class to myself. In sixty seconds he eloquently summarised each of the twelve principal points I had made. He did so without referring to the copious notes he had made during my talk and he did so more concisely than I could ever do, even with my own notes and Powerpoint display.

A few years later, I met up with the instructor who had introduced me to that class. He asked me whether I'd met that kid since. I hadn't. He told me that the lad, nicknamed in the Office as Florence of Arabia, had nominally taken a sabbatical from the Service; hailed a London cab to Istanbul (as you do!); then walked from there to Bangladesh, albeit in three separate trips spread across a couple of years.

****! That takes balls of brass and nerves of steel. The man is hard as nails, though he does not look it.

Next I saw of him was when he gave a talk to TED, on my own home turf in Embra, on the matter of Afghanistan.





He can talk equally well on obscure subjects such as hedgehogs. Here he speaks knowledgeably and fluently without notes. A formidable performance, by any measure.
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He's insightful, knowlegeable, and profoundly intelligent. Not at all what the Tories choose in their leaders. They tend to choose ****, arseholes, nincompoops, and demogogues like Heath, Major, Ian Dunkin-Smythe and Attila the Hen.

He's not a convincing Brexiteer, so not to my taste in potential leaders of the free world; and I don't think there's room for two Etonians in that sack race on Tory Sports Day, though I do recognise that he'd wipe the floor with the mop-head in a two-way intellectual debate.

He's still wrong about Brexit, fundamentally because he isn't prepared to carry out the will of the people, and just as importantly the promises made that got him elected. He should stick to hedgehogs

Yup.

He's as wrong about democracy as Dawkins is:--- and for pretty much the same reason.

He's a thinker. That's the problem.

He is not a consistently logical thinker.
No one can be a true scientist and an atheist advocate, anymore than one can be a true scientist and a religious advocate. Science requires evidence, and has to produce testable theories. Atheism has no good evidence for it any more than religion has for itself.
'Qualified' Democracy is as much an oxymoron as representative democracy is in practice today. However, Dawkins is not an MP and hasn't made any promises, so he can say what he likes about voting. However, what has triggered the discussion is something which everyone seems reluctant to discuss, which is that too many decisions made by Government affect too many people. The problem is that Government is too powerful, and this is the real root of the problem. It's not whether the EU or the UK should be telling me what kind of bananas I can eat, it's that either of them can.
Government has a lot less influence on us around here, we ignore the laws we don't like, and there's naff all in practice that the Government can do about it. The population density is too low to make any kind of inspection and/or enforcement financially possible when the general population decide not to do something. I am very happy with that. I don't think I'm unique in these respects among people on this forum. You seem to enjoy a great deal of latitude in that respect yourself.

Atheism has no good evidence for it any more than religion has for itself.

True, and since the ultimate experiment can and never will be performed I can't see how anyone can be 100% atheist or have 100% faith in any religion.

I admit respecting Dawkins but I think he's outside his expertise on this one.

Well, one can believe 100%. But one can't be scientifically sure (or anything close). Nor can one scientifically prove the believers are wrong about the existence of their God.
There may be a God, or lots of them, or even all of them. We don't know.

I always like the Rowan Atkinson sketch where he plays the Devil welcoming a new batch to Hell. After sorting out all the mass murderers, thieves, and adulterers ("My, what a lot of you!"), he then announces "Christians, are you here? Yes, I'm afraid the Jews were right"

Well you got a point. I used to believe in Santa Claus 100% even when he was seen in every major shopping centre in Adelaide. I think I was 10 when I was informed it's all bollocks.

Biggest disappointments at age 5 was being told that Star Trek and Thunderbirds are 'science fiction' (never heard of the term). Up till then I'd made up my mind to be a Starship captain. Failing that I'd apply to IR as TB1 pilot. Hell even Galasphere 347 wasn't spared, although I'd boot out Larry Dart and Slim. Husky was ok.

I secretly still wanna command the Constitutional class starship NCC-1701A though.

Fox3WheresMyBanana wrote: ↑

Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:11 am

I always like the Rowan Atkinson sketch where he plays the Devil welcoming a new batch to Hell. After sorting out all the mass murderers, thieves, and adulterers ("My, what a lot of you!"), he then announces "Christians, are you here? Yes, I'm afraid the Jews were right"

Is that how the '22 Committee narrowed down the field?

It would certainly be possible, UP.

p.s. Slash, I have been Santa Claus, so he's real!!

I think yer average Remainer yob has about as much logic as these buggers do.

I used that scene when teaching A level critical thinking!

"So, if she's the same weight as a duck...she's a witch!"
"It's a fair cop"

Plum - I agree about his courage. I read his book 'The Places In Between' a few years ago about walking on his own through Afghanistan in 2002. Inspiring, educational and very well written. Far too clever to lead the Conservatives but hopefully he'll get a good position after the leadership election.

Slash - is that a Freudian slip of the lips on her part?

Nothing like using tax payers money for a spot of personal vanity really.....there again, she is the MP for Tatton so her constituents will probably be all in favour......

For those who are uncertain as to the location, and pretentions, of the constituency, if you dep / arrive to and from the West at the shopping mall formerly known as MAN, you will cross the quaint little hamlet, complete with almost permanent gridlock, known as Knutsford. Noted for it's sub tropical climate, there is an abundance of outdoor swimming pools !....note, these are not be confused with the natural pools known as meres


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... otographer

When Blair became PM I instinctively didn't trust him, I thought that he was false and dangerous and was surprised that others didn't see the same, I have the same feeling with Boris.
Nigel is giving a crisp, clear idea of his position, his plan and how he will go about it, this has resulted in a large exodus from the traditional Tory supporting electorate, I feel rather insulted that the Tories think that a main reason for electing him PM is to attract my vote back.
Here is his ideas on his potential premiership,

" I,I,I eh eh, listen, I, I, I, Quod in ludo mentis scriba, err, err, I, I, Cornish pasty, err, err …. hurrah."

It might well be that on 31st October we will be waving union jacks, eating pasties and small children will be excitedly running around in Boris wigs as we vacate the EU, but I doubt it.
Con man.


I think that we have had enough languid Ex Etonians in Government, we need a good used car salesman or someone with a good track record of running successful Bingo Halls to get us out of this mess with the EU.