Chaos in USA

[Undried Plum]

Here's Bloomberg's take on the subjectmatter of what I said:

Oops!

For some reason when I pasted the URL, it went to an advert instead.

Try this:



Yup, that's the one.

[G-CPTN]

Thanks.

[ian16th]

Perhaps I'm intrigued by the simplicity of a bolt action rifle and the fact I've never had one. The magazine would be nice but it complicates the rifle, a wrinkle I want to avoid. I also suspect there is nothing more reliable than a bolt action weapon. Also there is a wide choice of bolt action hunting rifles out there, some of them very classy (and expensive), and the good ones can tend to appreciate wildly. The Merkel K3 single fire has caught my eye.

What does a good condition Smely cost in the USA?

From Wiki it seems as though they are still in production, but the quality might not be 100%.

[BenThere]

I haven't seriously looked at the used market, but the new, single shot K3 goes for $5,000 or so. That's a steep price but it's an instant heirloom if cared for, built to last for generations of regular use.

My local 'Cabela's had a used one and allowed me to handle it. It was immediately clear that the craftsmanship was exceptional, the feel was solid and comfortable in firing position, and the bolt action was smooth as silk. The woodwork was supreme and I lusted after the thing. Cabela's wanted $5,000 for the used weapon, but they tend to overprice the market at their retail stores.

[BenThere]

Got this flash from the past in the mail. Very prescient to say this in 1964. Hope the link works.

https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0?ui=2&i ... &disp=safe

[G-CPTN]

Nope . . .

[boing]

Ian,

As a collector of Enfields I will comment if I may.

It all depends on originality and condition. Many UK rifles were dumped on the US market as nowhere else in the World had the ownership laws, UK political approval, money and capacity to accept them. They were sold extremely cheaply and many were bought as low-priced hunting rifles and immediately butchered by chopping off the full-length wooden fore-ends and filing away metal. This fate overtook many fine rifles as no one in the US could really differentiate the collectibility of the individual items.

There are still many of these butchered rifles available on the make-me-an-offer racks of gunshops. As an active pilot visiting many cities I made a point of keeping an eye on the gunshops and I did find the occasional gem. For example, a nearly complete experimental version of what was to become the Mk.4 rifle of which only 2000 we made. That would be a very high priced collectable item. You can probably buy a butchered 303 for a $100. I also have a couple of 303s that came out of Africa during Mau Mau, "regulated" by Holland and Holland.

Now that military surplus 303 ammunition is less readily available ammunition is fairly expensive.
.

[Dushan]

Here is one for 1,100 CAD, but it looks like it has been "altered".



https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/s ... -condition

[BenThere]

I should have said the Merkel K3 Stutzen rifle is single shot, but a breech loaded, not bolt action rifle. The few others I've browsed are bolt action. Browning still makes them.

The rounds in high quality Federal 200 round boxes run about $1/round, if you can find them these days. There's a run on guns and ammo going on these days.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/20 ... 124011001/

I relate to the thoughts and motivations expressed here:

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020 ... d-in-june/

[boing]

Dushan,

That is an early version of the #1 rifle. You can tell this because it has the magazine cut-off plate (last photo). This was designed to stop soldiers using too much ammunition in rapid fire. The idea was they kept a full mag. of ten rounds loaded but the cut-off plate prevented these rounds feeding when the bolt was operated. In effect the rifle was used as a single shot with the magazine in reserve until the NCO ordered other wise when retracting the plate allowed the magazine to be used.
Metal work looks good but much of the wood has been removed and it would be very difficult to find genuine matching replacements for the fore-end wood and metal hoops that held it in place.

.

[ian16th]

Now that military surplus 303 ammunition is less readily available ammunition is fairly expensive.

So what would the 'once a year, 40 rounds through a Bren' cost today?

I can still remember the 10 rounds application, 10 rounds automatic.
Carry out a 1st 'Immediate Action', and then rattle off the 20 rounds from the 2nd magazine.

[boing]

Yes Ian, a "mag dump", as they are called here, from a Bren was a lot of fun. Wasn't much left of the paper plate afterwards. I had a friend, a rock-ape Flight Sergeant, who gave me unofficial training and taught me lots of good stuff the service did not approve of. He would have been in big trouble if officialdom had known what was going on. I was qualified marksman on Browning pistol, Sten Gun, SLR and Bren Gun thanks to him. Great guy and marvellous practical instructor, Scottish of course and total fun.

Once almost everybody that mattered produced 303 ammunition, UK, Canada, India, Pakistan, Australia and even Iraq and it was loaded commercially in the USA. The supply slowly reduced until only the Pakistani stuff and American commercial production was left. Same thing is happening with 308 ammo. now. Part of the equation is that several countries do not sell off their surplus as part of an arms embargo, they would rather burn it. We have plenty of US production available but probably the next most prolific production is from Russia who I don't think ever used a 308 calibre rifle.

Just to pee-off our UK antis I will mention that I can drive for 15 minutes and pick up all of the powder, primers and projectiles I need at the local sporting goods store with no restrictions. I have thousands of brass cases for various ammunition types that I have collected over the years. All I do not have is time to put them all together.

Just checked. Prices are better than I expected. 20 rounds for about $16 commercial imported ammo , possibly Eastern European. A mag-full every so often would not be too bad.

.

[PHXPhlyer]

Ammo prices for bulk have gone up 25-30% in the last few months. I'm glad that I did a minor stock-up of main calibers.

PP

[barkingmad]

It’s reassuring to see this thread has returned to the OP #1, only now the discussion is the nuts, bolts, powder and cartridge cases of the weaponry out there on the loose.

Sadly I await the next mass shooting which will probably occur sooner rather than later as a result of Covid-1984 induced madness.

So when and where will be the next ‘erewego again’ event? I’m surprised in the current febrile atmosphere that something of that nature has not already occurred and it will be interesting to see the POTUS reaction.

Then at the beginning of 2021 the stats for deaths by shootings can be compared with those attributed directly to the pestilence.
Alas there is no known vaccination to help prevent the fatalities and injuries from gun violence...

[boing]

BM

Any violence is similar to Covid really, some people put themselves into risky situations others socially distance. If you want to make a lot of money illegally pushing drugs someone is going to illegally relieve you of some of your takings. If your gang and another gang disagree about the boundaries of your territory you will fight over it and someone will die.

If the violence does not effect the common man I say go for it, it is much quicker and cleaner than court cases. And if the communities involved play "shut mouth" because they hate the police more than they do the gang members they get what they ask for.

.

[boing]

USA Today, hardly a right-wing bastion. Note the last sentence

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/ ... 235072001/

OPINION
There is no epidemic of fatal police shootings against unarmed Black Americans
Ideally officers would never need to take anyone's life. But the data on police killings doesn't support reducing or abolishing law enforcement.
Heather Mac Donald
Opinion contributor

The video of George Floyd’s tragic death under the knee of a Minneapolis police officer has led many to ask whether it represents the tip of an iceberg of police brutality. For centuries, United States law enforcement was interwoven with slavery and segregation, and that memory cannot be easily erased. But the evidence does not support the charge that biased police are systematically killing Black Americans in fatal shootings.

Much of modern policing is driven by crime data and community demands for help. The African American community tends to be policed more heavily, because that is where people are disproportionately hurt by violent street crime. In New York City in 2018, 73% of shooting victims were Black, though Black residents comprise only 24% of the city’s population.

.

[prospector]

Why are black people referred to as African Americans? have they ever been to Africa? if they had would they have stayed there? why are they not just called Americans, or perhaps just black Americans?

[PHXPhlyer]

Colored
Negro
Afro
Black
African American
Not sure of the order which each became the preferred appellation.
And, of course, early on and now till used amongst themselves, The N Word
What was common and even prefered has changed over time. One has to be careful to be up to date so to be PC.

PP

[EA01]

There's an African American in the woodpile?

[ExSp33db1rd]

Was Gibsons dog a Kenyan Pit Bull ?