Millions of us might be **** if we ignore the Russian-Ukraine war

[prospector]

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/world/ge ... hp&pc=U531



"Ukraine's Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba on Saturday condemned Germany for its refusal to supply weapons to Kyiv, urging Berlin to stop "undermining unity" and "encouraging Vladimir Putin" amid fears of a Russian invasion."

https://www.foxnews.com/world/us-embass ... -officials

[Bob]

The West (AKA the USA and its satellites) are doing really well in the Propaganda war, Im not looking forward to the real one they are provoking and indeed doing their best to deceive the world into thinking its inevitable or even already started

Utter bastards leading the world into conflict so they can expand their empire into places they have **** all to do with and **** all right to interfere with
As ever the hypocrisy involved orbits some miles above the Average Septic's head

[Undried Plum]

It's getting seriously dangerous now. Covert ops such as insertion of UKSF and the use of RAF AT to stoke the flames of war with high tech weaponry in bulk, which previously would have been done on a deniable basis, are now being done overtly.

The situation is, in several sinister ways, very similar to the buildup up of WW1 in Europe when there was a silly level of excessive armaments on all sides and silly alliances were being formed.

[Boac]

It's getting seriously dangerous now

Ah! You noticed the Russian build-up then?

[OFSO]

I see only one solution. Get the French involved and make sure that they have a good supply of staves and white textiles.

[Undried Plum]

The Russian 'buildup' of troops and munitions on their own territory isn't the worrying bit.

The problem is NATO military expansionism coinciding with pouring NATO weapons and NATO Special Forces into Ukraine while conducting a relentless daily propaganda effort on UK (and US et al) meeja which attempts to convince the sheeple that Russia is a military threat to us. That, right there, is the threat to peace and security in Europe.

Just as in 1914, all it will take is a spark to start a conflagration. Archduke Ferdinand wasn't actually important to the British Empire. Neither is Ukraine.

As the US State Department official put it: "**** EU". What she actual meant was "Fukk Europe".

Let's never forget that some of these people really are crazy enough to use nuclear weapons.

[Boac]

The Russian 'buildup' of troops and munitions on their own territory isn't the worrying bit.

Bolleaux. If they were not there, there would be no pending crisis.

I tell 'e wot, tho. If 'NATO' does back down as demanded, AK will be looking over his shoulder.

[prospector]

"Bolleaux. If they were not there, there would be no pending crisis" What did the Americans do when Soviet Union was going to put missiles in Cuba? did they not build up their forces in that region??

If NATO forces were not being encouraged to move into Ukraine would the Russian forces be built up there. How many wars has Russia, not the Soviet Union , been involved in since the second world war? How many wars has the USA been involved in? and for what purpose? has any of those countries demolished by the USA been any threat to the USA?, it really is a misnomer to call them a Defence Force, more accurate to call them an invading force.

[John Hill]

Yeabut, where is the proof?

[Undried Plum]

The Russian 'buildup' of troops and munitions on their own territory isn't the worrying bit.

Bolleaux. If they were not there, there would be no pending crisis.

If there were no Russian troops in Russia, there would be no NATO troops in Ukraine?

Is that really what you believe?

The artificial 'crisis' has been created by NATO's warmongering and gobshite propaganda.

We in Western Europe have no bone to pick with Russia. Sure, America's imperialistic fascism would like to take Russia back to the bad old days of the 1990s when American robber-baronism buggered the economy and social cohesion of Russia. Sure, the Septics would like to cut Russia's immense gas reserves off from being supplied to the West European buyers so that the US frackers can make a killing.

That's not a reason for European countries to get involved with The Empire's evil plan(s).

Have we learned nothing? Haven't we learned that a military conquest of Russia is doomed to fail?

Last time the British Empire, and the French and the Turks, conquered a wee bit of Russia at Sevastopol, what did we do with it? We trashed the port facilities and buggered off home. The Russians have been there ever since.

We have no business fighting against Russia in Crimea or Ukraine or anywhere else.

[om15]

We have no business fighting against Russia in Crimea or Ukraine or anywhere else

I agree with that. One thing is for sure, whatever happens the EU will screw it all up, the Jerries have already blocked arms going to Ukraine, if Putin wishes to demonstrate European disunity he is on the right track.

[FD2]

Here's one German who has **** himself with no outside help. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -cost.html


German navy chief resigns for saying Putin wants 'respect' and giving it to him would be 'low cost' after nation was condemned for refusing to supply weapons to Kiev

Vice Admiral Kay-Achim Shoenbach said: 'It is easy to give him the respect he wants and probably deserves as well'
His remarks made at event in India on Friday caused outrage in Ukraine
Ukraine foreign ministry called German ambassador in to complain about them
Mr Shoenbach yesterday resigned, accepted by Defence Minister Christine Lambrecht
It comes as Germany were criticised for refusing to supply arms to Ukraine despite a growing crisis between the country and Russia

'Mr' already? Not really, just the DM child who wrote this doesn't understand that he's resigned not been kicked out the Navy.
It's always 'outrage' these days isn't it, never 'upset', 'annoyance' or whatever?

It comes as the German government has insisted that it stands united with its Nato allies on the issue of Russia's military threat to Ukraine, warning that Moscow will pay a high price if it makes any military moves against its neighbour.

But unlike many other Nato countries, Berlin said it will not supply Ukraine with lethal weapons, arguing that it does not want to inflame tensions further.

Germany has also blocked their Nato ally Estonia from supplying arms to Ukraine, according to the Telegraph.

This is despite the US and Washington endorsing Baltic shipments of anti-tank and anti-aircraft missiles to Kyiv.

It has led some to accuse Germany of failing to stand up to Putin as tension on Russia's border with Europe mounts.

Vlad must be laughing his head off.

Just stating the bleeding obvious:

Schoenbach.png (401.62 KiB) Viewed 2044 times

[FD2]

Is it chicken or egg first? The UK and others are supplying self defence weapons to the vastly outgunned/tanked Ukrainians. There have been moves to allow Ukraine to join NATO for some time. Was the above mentioned build up of Soviet troops and the encirclement of Ukraine in conjunction with Vlad's thug mate to the north before or after these weapons were being supplied to Ukraine?

Less RT inspired purple prose please! I'm convinced that the build up of tension in the area is because Vlad wants to build up his status at home amongst the Russian 'sheeple' and at the moment he can, because the EU is hopeless and divided (especially among those who don't want to freeze to death), the UK leadership wants some distraction from Partygate and the US is being led by a real semi-senile 'dotard' (as opposed to the previous incumbent, called that by Kim the Rocket Man!). What better time to help his fellow Russians in Eastern Ukraine rejoin the beloved motherland? You know - that lot who shot down the Malaysian airliner with a Russian supplied missile?

[prospector]

You may be convinced, but many are not.

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/l ... story.html

"Leaders in Moscow, however, tell a different story. For them, Russia is the aggrieved party. They claim the United States has failed to uphold a promise that NATO would not expand into Eastern Europe, a deal made during the 1990 negotiations between the West and the Soviet Union over German unification. In this view, Russia is being forced to forestall NATO’s eastward march as a matter of self-defense.

The West has vigorously protested that no such deal was ever struck. However, hundreds of memos, meeting minutes and transcripts from U.S. archives indicate otherwise. Although what the documents reveal isn’t enough to make Putin a saint, it suggests that the diagnosis of Russian predation isn’t entirely fair. Europe’s stability may depend just as much on the West’s willingness to reassure Russia about NATO’s limits as on deterring Moscow’s adventurism."

There is no way President Putin is a saint, but look at the crap that has been aimed at Russia for decades, here is one example

https://www.rt.com/russia/546848-havana ... aign=Email
By Paul Robinson, a professor at the University of Ottawa. He writes about Russian and Soviet history, military history and military ethics, and is author of the Irrussianality blog. He tweets at @Irrussianality.

Published by R.T., but written by a Canadian professor, does that make it any less credible??

[John Hill]

Is it true that Putin has asked the Taliban to help throwing the Septics out of Ukraine?

[Seenenough]

It amazes me how quickly the "we've got all the answers" crew on this forum seem to have forgotten (more likely ignored )that Biden's connections with the Ukraine are not limited to diplomatic channels alone.

[John Hill]

It amazes me how quickly the "we've got all the answers" crew on this forum seem to have forgotten (more likely ignored )that Biden's connections with the Ukraine are not limited to diplomatic channels alone.

Oh yeah? Was any of that story true?

[FD2]

It amazes me how quickly the "we've got all the answers" crew on this forum seem to have forgotten (more likely ignored )that Biden's connections with the Ukraine are not limited to diplomatic channels alone.

I'd forgotten that sleazy episode.

[FD2]

"Leaders in Moscow, however, tell a different story. For them, Russia is the aggrieved party. They claim the United States has failed to uphold a promise that NATO would not expand into Eastern Europe, a deal made during the 1990 negotiations between the West and the Soviet Union over German unification. In this view, Russia is being forced to forestall NATO’s eastward march as a matter of self-defense.

The West has vigorously protested that no such deal was ever struck. However, hundreds of memos, meeting minutes and transcripts from U.S. archives indicate otherwise. Although what the documents reveal isn’t enough to make Putin a saint, it suggests that the diagnosis of Russian predation isn’t entirely fair. Europe’s stability may depend just as much on the West’s willingness to reassure Russia about NATO’s limits as on deterring Moscow’s adventurism."

That's as good an excuse to peg on the latest adventure but I don't think Russia will be persuaded by anything at the moment and they are determined to bring the matter to a head, when the West is so obviously in disarray. I'd concede that the relentless march of NATO to the east has impinged on Russia's sphere of gentle influence but what will happen in Ukraine without the West's support? The war in the east of the country has shown no sign of being settled and I can't see the Ukrainians letting go of another huge slice of territory without a fight, even if it might be classified as 'historically Russian'.

Putin has the western powers over a barrel at last, having successfully worked his regime into this position over several years while the west took their collective eyes off the ball.

[Seenenough]

"Leaders in Moscow, however, tell a different story. For them, Russia is the aggrieved party. They claim the United States has failed to uphold a promise that NATO would not expand into Eastern Europe, a deal made during the 1990 negotiations between the West and the Soviet Union over German unification. In this view, Russia is being forced to forestall NATO’s eastward march as a matter of self-defense.

The West has vigorously protested that no such deal was ever struck. However, hundreds of memos, meeting minutes and transcripts from U.S. archives indicate otherwise. Although what the documents reveal isn’t enough to make Putin a saint, it suggests that the diagnosis of Russian predation isn’t entirely fair. Europe’s stability may depend just as much on the West’s willingness to reassure Russia about NATO’s limits as on deterring Moscow’s adventurism."

That's as good an excuse to peg on the latest adventure but I don't think Russia will be persuaded by anything at the moment and they are determined to bring the matter to a head, when the West is so obviously in disarray. I'd concede that the relentless march of NATO to the east has impinged on Russia's sphere of gentle influence but what will happen in Ukraine without the West's support? The war in the east of the country has shown no sign of being settled and I can't see the Ukrainians letting go of another huge slice of territory without a fight, even if it might be classified as 'historically Russian'.

Putin has the western powers over a barrel at last, having successfully worked his regime into this position over several years while the west took their collective eyes off the ball.

Should read Putin has the western Europen powers over a barrel at last.....