MH370

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Capetonian

Re: MH370

#81 Post by Capetonian » Sat Jul 28, 2018 3:21 pm

https://www.businessinsider.co.za/mh370 ... ort-2018-7

The full article is worth reading but offers little more than a summary of what is known and the many theories. I think the last sentence is probably the reality.
The mystery of MH370 is about to be laid to rest for good — here are all the theories, dead ends, and unanswered questions from the most bizarre airline disaster of the century .........

..................This Monday, the Malaysian government, which has taken chief responsibility for investigating the disappearance, will issue what it claims is the final report on the fate of the plane..........

Monday's report may offer new answers, or it might increase the likelihood that the fate of MH370 might never be known.

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Re: MH370

#82 Post by flynverted » Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:34 am

What happened to MH370?? Lots of reports say the Cap'n flew it until it ran out of fuel. I don't buy into that theory, the holes in the Swiss cheese don't line up in my humble opinion. Someone other than the Cap'n flew it or programmed the autopilot.

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Re: MH370

#83 Post by Slasher » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:46 am

Think I mentioned it before but the fly in the ointment AFAIC was the participation by China in the original search, which was very unprecedented. It only conducts searches within its own FIRs and Int'l borders. The Chinese communist govt normally doesn't give a sh!t about its citizens - and thus I believe the full facts are being purposefully buried by the mutual agreement of multiple parties.

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Re: MH370

#84 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:52 am

Slasher, if we believe the theory of burying the truth (and by definition the ability of several hundreds people to keep absolutely secrecy) we should believe the chem-trail conspiracy. One of the points I use to refute the chem-trail is that a single person would be needed to blow the secret away.

I still believe that every single theory so far has sufficient holes to be discarded.

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Re: MH370

#85 Post by Alisoncc » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:12 am

RiS how about the known fact that the Bermuda Triangle has relocated to the middle of the Gulf of Thailand. This, I believe to have been at Slashers bidding.

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Re: MH370

#86 Post by Slasher » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:22 am

...Not so much burying the truth RiS but ensuring a crucial fact or set of facts remain undisclosed, for what purpose I wouldn't know. If you read over the entire (published) history of this incident from go to woe there are pieces missing, somewhat akin to a jigsaw.

But I hear what you say. I am no paranoid theorist by any means. For example with Roswell I'm completely satisfied with the report disclosed in Project Bluebook. If there was any coverup it would've surfaced no later than the mid '60s - for the reason you described.

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Re: MH370

#87 Post by flynverted » Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:43 am

Agree with Cap'n Slasher and RIS...
Something happened on the flight deck that night, and someone knows more than what is reported in the news....

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Re: MH370

#88 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sun Jul 29, 2018 11:10 am

So we can take it is not a safety issue!

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Re: MH370

#89 Post by OFSO » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:18 pm

Agree with Mr Slash. Someone knows (or knew) what happened. And not a flight safety incident, either.

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Re: MH370

#90 Post by ian16th » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:35 pm

There is one piece of hard evidence.
The part that washed up on the Isle de La Réunion
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Re: MH370

#91 Post by Rwy in Sight » Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:16 pm

If OFSO agrees that it was not technical/safety, can we safely exclude an act or terrorism - it makes little sense to commit to such an act and not claim responsibility!

So what does it leaves?

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Re: MH370

#92 Post by flynverted » Sun Jul 29, 2018 10:30 pm

Who's gonna accept responsibility for a suicide???

As far as I know, there have been 2 suicide/ murders by pf... Egypt air and German wings, and there may be more but these are known ones...
Then there was a U.S. ground crew agent who managed to get a firearm on board a commuter flt, shot the crew and drove the plane into the ground, and there is the fedex incident...
But I still don't buy into the theory that it was cap'n suicide...
Holes in the swiss cheese don't line up. It was someone else

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Re: MH370

#93 Post by Rwy in Sight » Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:35 am

Re the suicide case: We need to know whether suicidal people leave a note behind. As far I remember no such note was left. In any case the real reason should cause trouble to whoever would hide - a suicide does not fall in this category IMHO unless it has something to do with the Muslim pilot.

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Re: MH370

#94 Post by OFSO » Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:00 am

Anybody who has worked for the government or international governments knows some b-- strange things go on. Documents which were available yesterday are not only not available today but seemingly never existed in the first place; one's superior has a quiet word as to what really should not be touched upon in a report; priorities change unexpectedly and for no reason, and staff transfers take place with no warning. And that is in Europe.

Yes Governments do blunder, but a few competent people taking charge of a project can work wonders.

I very much doubt we will ever find out what happened to MH370, and that itself is an indication.

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Re: MH370

#95 Post by Capetonian » Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:49 am

As far as I know, there have been 2 suicide/ murders by pf... Egypt air and German wings, and there may be more but these are known ones...
And this one :
An Air Botswana pilot has crashed his plane in an apparent suicide mission, destroying all but one of the airline's fleet.

The pilot, Chris Phatswe, took off from Gabarone's Sir Seretse Khama airport on Monday and circled in an empty ATR-42 for almost two hours.

Officials said he radioed the control tower and announced: "I intend to kill myself."

As the plane ran short of fuel, Phatswe threatened to crash it into an Air Botswana office building to settle an apparent grudge with the airline's management.

After being told by the control tower that there were people in the Air Botswana building, Phatswe crashed the plane into two other ATR-42s on the tarmac, destroying the aircraft and himself in a fireball.

Air Botswana operations have been crippled, as the airline only has one plane left - a BAe-146 which is grounded with technical problems.
As for documents and reports 'disappearing' : SAA Helderberg/SA 295/28NOV87

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Re: MH370

#96 Post by Mrs Ex-Ascot » Mon Jul 30, 2018 3:44 pm

From the Guardian; https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... -ruled-out

It seems that this "final " report as expected doesn't come up with any answers, which is hardly surprising as the wreckage /Black boxes haven't been found. Speculation doesn't help the relatives of those lost souls. In cynical mood I'm wondering why this report was published in the first place as it serves no purpose to anyone.
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Re: MH370

#97 Post by Capetonian » Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:27 pm

As I suspected, a lot of people will have been paid a lot of money to produce a report that has no value to anyone. I am cynical too. As ever.

MH370 investigators say they can't rule out 'unlawful interference' as final report leaves relatives disappointed

Investigators released a report on missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 on Monday, saying the Boeing 777's controls were likely deliberately manipulated to take it off course but they were not able to determine who was responsible.

The 495-page report draws no conclusion about what happened aboard the plane that vanished with 239 people on board en route to Beijing from Kuala Lumpur on March 8, 2014, leaving one of the world's greatest aviation mysteries unsolved.

"The answer can only be conclusive if the wreckage is found," Kok Soo Chon, head of the MH370 safety investigation team, told reporters.

On May 29, Malaysia called off a three-month search by US firm Ocean Infinity, which spanned 112,000 sq km (43,243 sq miles) in the southern Indian Ocean and ended with no significant findings.

It was the second major search after Australia, China and Malaysia ended a fruitless A$200 million (£112.06 million) search across an area of 120,000 sq km (46,332 sq miles) last year.

Malaysian and international investigators have been looking into why the jet veered thousands of miles off course from its scheduled route before eventually plunging into the Indian Ocean.

The last communication from the plane was from the Captain Zaharie Ahmad Shah who signed off with “Good night, Malaysian three seven zero”, as the plane left the Malaysian airspace and later turned off course.

A 440-page final report by the Australian Transport Safety Bureau (ATSB) last year showed that Zaharie had flown a route on his home flight simulator six weeks earlier that was "initially similar" to the one actually taken by MH370.

The Malaysian police previously concluded there were no unusual activity on the home simulator.

Kok said the investigators examined the history of the pilot and the first officer, and they were satisfied with their background and training and mental health.

"We are not of the opinion it could have been an event committed by the pilots," he said, but added they were not ruling out any possibility since the in-air turn back was done manually and the systems in the plane were also manually turned off.

"We cannot exclude that there was an unlawful interference by a third party," Kok said.

He added all the passengers of the 15 countries had their backgrounds checked by their respective countries and all came back with a clean bill of health.

The inability to locate MH370's crash site has fuelled conspiracy theories and online debates over the last four years.

Theories range from mechanical error or a remote-controlled crash, to more bizarre explanations like alien abduction and a Russian plot.

Kok said they looked into each theory and rumour raised on social media.

"We had over 60 allegations...we removed them one-by-one and saw what remained behind," Kok said.

The report said there was no sign the plane was evading radar detection or that it was taken over by remote control. No irregularities were found in the on-board cargo, which included items like lithium batteries and about 2,500 kgs of mangosteen.
Mistakes made

In all, 27 pieces of aircraft debris have been collected from various places around the world but only three wing fragments that washed up along the Indian Ocean coast have been confirmed to be from MH370.

Malaysia's newly elected Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad has said Malaysia would consider resuming the search only if new clues come to light.

Investigators highlighted some mistakes made by the Kuala Lumpur and Ho Chi Minh City air traffic control centres and made safety recommendations to ensure such incidents do not occur again.

Transport Minister Antony Loke said in a statement that the Malaysia would investigate any misconduct committed based on the findings.
Families of passengers on board the flight said on Monday that the report failed to give closure

The next-of-kin of the passengers were briefed on the final report by investigators earlier on Monday.

"We hope that these mistakes will not be repeated and that measures are put in place to prevent them in the future," said Grace Nathan, a lawyer whose mother, Anne Daisy, was on the plane.

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Geng Shuang said Beijing had paid close attention to the MH370 investigation.

"We hope that all sides can continue to remain in close contact and coordination, to properly carry out relevant follow-up work," he told a daily news briefing, without elaborating.

The majority of passengers on board were Chinese.

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Re: MH370

#98 Post by Capetonian » Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:16 am

The following, from the Economist, is the tale of two other nations both known to be economical with the truth and wanting to deflect blame from themselves. There has not been a conclusive explanation for the crash of MS804. Sad, but unsurprising.
GULLIVER is not the type of person to kick up a fuss on his travels, least of all when lucky enough to be at the front of the plane. But his patience was pushed to the limit a couple of years ago, when his EgyptAir flight from Cairo to London was blighted by the near-constant stench of cigarette smoke wafting in from the cockpit. Shackled by British meekness and an unwillingness to challenge a flight crew, your asthmatic correspondent suffered the coughs and tried instead to focus on work. Conversations with Egyptian friends later revealed that on-board cigarette smoke is hardly a rarity when flying with the North African flag-carrier.

Naturally, anecdotes such as this provide only a snapshot of an airline’s safety standards. But it is a deeply disturbing snapshot given the stalled investigation into EgyptAir Flight 804, which crashed into the Mediterranean Sea during a routine flight from Paris to Cairo in 2016, killing all 66 people aboard. This month, France’s air-crash investigation agency, BEA, took the unusual step of criticising the official Egyptian investigation into the disaster. The French body rejects Egypt’s conclusion that a “malicious act” likely brought down the plane. When BEA was shown supposed evidence of explosive traces on the remains of some of the victims two years ago, it suggested that the test results may have been tampered with. It believes that a fire likely brought down the aircraft, basing its conclusion on three pieces of evidence: electronic signals sent from the plane indicating that smoke alarms were activated in the toilet and avionics bays; cockpit voice recordings that show the flight crew discussing an on-board fire; and wreckage that bears signs of high temperatures and soot.

Egypt has form for covering up air-crash investigations when it does not like where the facts are leading. Two decades ago, it rejected the findings of America’s National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), the foremost global authority in air crash investigations, when EgyptAir Flight 990 plunged into the Atlantic Ocean after taking off from New York. The NTSB—along with the entire global aviation community—believes that pilot suicide caused the disaster. Egypt blames a mechanical fault. Three years ago, Egyptian officials spent months denying that a bomb had brought down Metrojet Flight 9268, a Russian charter flight travelling from Sharm El Sheikh to St Petersburg. Their stance grudgingly shifted when it became clear that several European countries would keep travel bans in place until airport security had improved at the Red Sea resorts. In both cases, Egypt defied international consensus and sought to push a narrative that absolved its institutions of any blame. Its suggestion that terrorists destroyed Flight 804 fits with this pattern: any airport-security breach would this time be attributed to Paris Charles de Gaulle Airport, the last place where passengers and cargo were loaded onto the jet.

Unearthing the truth about Flight 804 will not bring back the 66 victims. But it may bring some closure to their relatives. And, if lessons can be learned, it probably will help save lives in future. BEA notes that Egypt ignored requests to conduct further tests relating to the fire theory and then failed to publish a final report into the crash. Without this, it says it has no platform on which “to set out its differences of opinion, as authorised by the international provisions”. This response, like Gulliver's, is too timid. The French body should take its concerns directly to the European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA), which has the power to ban EgyptAir from the European Union’s skies if it believes the airline’s regulator is failing to abide by international norms for air crash investigations.

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Re: MH370

#99 Post by Capetonian » Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:00 am

Malaysia's civil aviation chief said Tuesday he has resigned to take responsibility after an independent investigative report highlighted shortcomings in the air traffic control center during Flight 370's disappearance four years ago.

The report released Monday raised the possibility that the jet may have been hijacked even though there was no conclusive evidence of why the plane went off course and flew for over seven hours after severing communications.

Azharuddin Abdul Rahman said the report didn't blame the civil aviation department for the plane's loss but found that the Kuala Lumpur air traffic control center failed to comply with operating procedures.

"Therefore, it is with regret and after much thought and contemplation that I have decided to resign as Chairman of Civil Aviation Authority of Malaysia," he said in his statement, adding he has served his resignation and will step down in two weeks.

The jet carrying 239 people from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing vanished March 8, 2014, and is presumed to have crashed in the far southern Indian Ocean. The investigative report, prepared by a 19-member international team, said the cause of the disappearance cannot be determined until the wreckage and the plane's black boxes are found.

However, the report said the investigation showed lapses by air traffic control, including a failure to swiftly initiate an emergency response and monitor radar continuously, relying too much on information from Malaysia Airlines and not getting in touch with the military for help.

New Malaysian Transport Minister Anthony Loke said Tuesday the government has formed a committee to investigate and take action against any misconduct based on the report findings.

The report said there was insufficient information to determine if the aircraft broke up in the air or during impact with the ocean.

Scattered pieces of debris that washed ashore on African beaches and Indian Ocean islands indicated a distant remote stretch of the ocean where the plane likely crashed. But a government search by Australia, Malaysia and China failed to pinpoint a location. And a second, private search by U.S. company Ocean Infinity that finished at the end of May also found no sign of a possible crash site.

Malaysia's government has said it will resume search if credible evidence on the plane's location emerges.

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Re: MH370

#100 Post by flynverted » Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:54 pm

Thanks, Cape, I wasn't aware of that one..



10's of thousands of flight per year and 3 known pilot suicides...
I stand by my statement that It wasn't the cap'n. Someone flew or programmed George... But it wasn't the cap'n...
I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but something happened on that flight deck and it wasn't the Cap'n

Capetonian wrote:
Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:49 am
As far as I know, there have been 2 suicide/ murders by pf... Egypt air and German wings, and there may be more but these are known ones...
And this one :
An Air Botswana pilot has crashed his plane in an apparent suicide mission, destroying all but one of the airline's fleet.

The pilot, Chris Phatswe, took off from Gabarone's Sir Seretse Khama airport on Monday and circled in an empty ATR-42 for almost two hours.

Officials said he radioed the control tower and announced: "I intend to kill myself."

As the plane ran short of fuel, Phatswe threatened to crash it into an Air Botswana office building to settle an apparent grudge with the airline's management.

After being told by the control tower that there were people in the Air Botswana building, Phatswe crashed the plane into two other ATR-42s on the tarmac, destroying the aircraft and himself in a fireball.

Air Botswana operations have been crippled, as the airline only has one plane left - a BAe-146 which is grounded with technical problems.
As for documents and reports 'disappearing' : SAA Helderberg/SA 295/28NOV87

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