ET crash ADD NBO

[Pontius Navigator]

Well done, Herr Drumpff!

Is Caligula now going to make his horse the new Administrator of the FAA?

How long will it be before Chump changes his mind?

"Read my lips"

"I did not have sex with that woman"

"No more America Last."my

And other famous sound bites

[Undried Plum]

Attitude + Power = Performance

Fly the wing.

I do wonder how many of the Nintendo generation of pilots really have those words in the frontal lobe of their brains.

They ought to be printed in red at the top of each page of the QRH.

[Pontius Navigator]

It occurs to me that Boeing lost the initiative. They should have pre-empted the grounding order. Instead Trump wins and they lose.

What model is the P8 based on?

[Boac]

I have read of one incident, aircraft type unknown, where the AoA gauge literally froze on climbout after it had been washed incorrectly.

- fox - see post #100 - Airbus, off Perpignan.

"Accident on 27 November 2008
off the coast of Canet-Plage (66)
to the Airbus A320-232
registered D-AXLA
operated by XL Airways Germany"

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

Thank you!
That's what happens when I post before six in the morning and my second cup of coffee. Must stop doing it!

[Slasher]

I have read of one incident, aircraft type unknown, where the AoA gauge literally froze on climbout after it had been washed incorrectly.

- fox - see post #100 - Airbus, off Perpignan.

"Accident on 27 November 2008
off the coast of Canet-Plage (66)
to the Airbus A320-232
registered D-AXLA
operated by XL Airways Germany"

Correct Boac. And there's a drill for AoA freezing (ADR x 3 check) as well as thrust tables for .76 / 275kts (Vturb).

[Boac]

What model is the P8 based on?

- the whole problem with this is that the answer is the 737-100, stretched and modified and 'updated' through the 200-800, and the final 'fix' to avoid a new type certificate was MCAS (plus the spectre of other 'unknown' fixes Boeing put in without telling anyone..........)

[Slasher]

...and avoid a new costly wing design Boac.

[k3k3]

I thought the wing had been substantially changed over the decades, but if you do it little by little, bit by bit, each change is just a minor mod rather than a cumulative major re-design.

[Boac]

The black boxes of crashed Ethiopian Boeing 737MAX arrived in Paris this morning on board Ethiopian Airlines flight #ET704 and have been transferred to Paris Le Bourget for the analysis by BEA.

[OFSO]

Post #144 - and some of the debris was caught in the permanent north-to-south current off the Cap de Creus and arrived near where I was living. I believe cause of the crash was performing a manual reversion at too low attitude to recover from the consequenses.

[barkingmad]

IIRC there has been considerable chatter in the last couple of years at least concerning lowered morale, bad management and dodgy practices (to mention but a few problems) in the Boeing organisation.

Before I got hacked off with T O P I recall many postings on the topic and some long before the 787 battery fiasco.

When my learned friends sharpen their quill pens for the inevitable major lawsuits will they be venturing into this area and seeking current or former whistleblowers and examining any allegations of substandard management? As usual, not holding my breath due age.

As an aside, I recall seeing somewhere the cost of installing dual AoA indicators for the pilots was quoted as a few 10s of thousands of dollars extra per 'frame, seems steep as most of the hardware & wiring is apparently standard factory fit. Would this basic info regarding the behaviour of the wing have helped these unfortunate crews and does not the factory cost look like peanuts compared with the litigation coming down the track towards Chicago?

Time for me to prepare my lunch but against modern business practice I regret it will not be outsourced but made inhouse!!

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

The 'low base price + expensive 'options' which are necessities' model is widespread now. I'll bet they teach it on MBAs, along with making the base model practically unobtainable. Tesla, anyone?

[Undried Plum]

B737Max Version101.000 The basic version: $ 100,000,000
That version incorporates a feature that'll kill you 'cos it won't show the pilots **** is going on in the hidden electronickery.

B737Max Version101.001 The enhanced version: $ 100,065,000
This version tells the pilots what the AoA in use thinks it knows about the AoA and gives the intelligent ones a bit of a clue as to why they are about to die unless they start flying the wing the way a proper pilot ought to be doing anyway.

[Boac]

The NYT has more info on the decision: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/201 ... ation.html

A new monster rears its head on the Max - how much training are crews getting on this? (With acknowledgement to Chris Brady's excellent 737 site):

Elevator Jam Landing Assist

This will give limited changes to the vertical flight path from the spoilers to assist the approach and landing if the normal elevator system jams. The control panel is located on the Aft Overhead Panel, even if it is switched on it will only be active when the flaps are 1 or greater. When in use, the spoilers rise to a preset position; they then extend or retract as the elevator column is pushed or pulled to increase or decrease the rate of descent.


So, apparently we have spoilers deploying (via software, of course...) in the event of an 'Elevator Jam'. I am not alone in wondering how such an event is determined (by the soft-ware, of course...) and whether this may have contributed to the apparent lack of climb in this accident after take-off.

[Stoneboat]

Fox I seem to recall the 'bus with the bad wash was with Lan Chile. They'd taped the static ports to wash the airplane and forgot to remove the tape.

[Boac]

No, Stone - #144.

BBC now reporting grounded 'until May'!! That'll make some eyes water.

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

Forgive me, but how hard is it to see the ports on an airliner?
I checked everything on my jets, including (gently) checking the AoA gauges were free to rotate (I doubt this is possible though)

[k3k3]

I saw one case where the wash crew had used speedtape...

[Stoneboat]

I saw one case where the wash crew had used speedtape...

 << by Boac » Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:35 pm

No, Stone - #144.>>
Ok that's the one I was thinking of. A little research and it was Aero Peru, and a 767.