ms804
- Wodrick
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ms804
New report points to cigarettes and oxygen as the cause of MS804 crash
In May 2016, EgyptAir flight 804 crashed into the Mediterranean Sea en route from Paris to Cairo. Preliminary findings, based on evidence retrieved from the black boxes and analyzed by the French BEA, indicated the presence of fire onboard the aircraft. The Egyptian government subsequently declared that explosive residue had been found and turned the investigation over to judicial authorities. Now a confidential report developed by French experts and obtained by Italian newspaper Corriere Della Sera indicates the most likely cause of the crash was a fire initiated by one of the pilots smoking near a leaking emergency oxygen mask.
In May 2016, EgyptAir flight 804 crashed into the Mediterranean Sea en route from Paris to Cairo. Preliminary findings, based on evidence retrieved from the black boxes and analyzed by the French BEA, indicated the presence of fire onboard the aircraft. The Egyptian government subsequently declared that explosive residue had been found and turned the investigation over to judicial authorities. Now a confidential report developed by French experts and obtained by Italian newspaper Corriere Della Sera indicates the most likely cause of the crash was a fire initiated by one of the pilots smoking near a leaking emergency oxygen mask.
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/ITORRO10?cm_ven=localwx_pwsdash
- Rwy in Sight
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Re: ms804
Now Egyptians and smoking - I know they don't mix.
- Ex-Ascot
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Re: ms804
In the days you could smoke on aircraft our nav had a cigarette in an ashtray next to his oxygen mask. He knocked it to 100% and ended up with a flamethrower across his desk. It incinerated all his charts. It could have been a very nasty incident but it was OK he knew the way home.
'Yes, Madam, I am drunk, but in the morning I shall be sober and you will still be ugly.' Sir Winston Churchill.
- barkingmad
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Re: ms804
IIRC one of the training films in the RAF, highlighting the fire dangers of oxygen, featured a clip of a C130 Hercules navigator eating a buttery cheese sandwich whilst wearing his O2 mask in between bites, presumably as the rear ramp was open for high altitude ops.
A quite realistic conflagration in/around the O2 mask was cleverly depicted, causing great mirth amongst the steely-eyed viewers.
I couldn’t help wondering afterwards with fire needing fuel, oxygen and a source of ignition, what was the source of ignition in this ‘incident’?
As beards were not then permitted, except with the exemption by a MO, was it static from a moustache or the grinding of the nav’s teeth as he watched the pilots ruining his plot with inaccurate flying?
Maybe someone from that era and type could put my mind at rest, as I still get nervous sipping my 57% ABV gin or whiskey in case I have not taken adequate precautions against such a disaster?
A quite realistic conflagration in/around the O2 mask was cleverly depicted, causing great mirth amongst the steely-eyed viewers.
I couldn’t help wondering afterwards with fire needing fuel, oxygen and a source of ignition, what was the source of ignition in this ‘incident’?
As beards were not then permitted, except with the exemption by a MO, was it static from a moustache or the grinding of the nav’s teeth as he watched the pilots ruining his plot with inaccurate flying?
Maybe someone from that era and type could put my mind at rest, as I still get nervous sipping my 57% ABV gin or whiskey in case I have not taken adequate precautions against such a disaster?
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Re: ms804
You are correct that, for a fire to start, you need fuel, oxygen and a source of ignition.
In the case of oils and greases they can provide both the oil and fuel in an oxygen rich environment.
Given that a fire is really just fast oxidation, it is possible for oils and greases (buttery cheese) to oxidise quickly enough, in an oxygen rich environment,to provide enough heat (spark) to ignite.
It is for good reason that OSHA regs require oily rags to be stored in sealed containers.
In the case of oils and greases they can provide both the oil and fuel in an oxygen rich environment.
Given that a fire is really just fast oxidation, it is possible for oils and greases (buttery cheese) to oxidise quickly enough, in an oxygen rich environment,to provide enough heat (spark) to ignite.
It is for good reason that OSHA regs require oily rags to be stored in sealed containers.
- ExSp33db1rd
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Re: ms804
I seem to recall that on our 707, or 747 ? , we had an additional, cabin style. portable oxygen bottle mounted just inside the cockpit door, in easy reach of the Flt. Eng. many of whom conveniently hung their uniform cap on it as they walked in and sat down - until one caught fire in flight, fortunately without serious incident, don't recall the details - which was attributed to a slight leak from the bottle acting on the grease inside the cap. Murphy is always with us..........next to his oxygen mask........
Re: ms804
In a pure oxygen environment you don't need a source of ignition for a lot of things. If you've ever seen the oxygen piping in a hospital it will have big warnings near all the valves that grease should not be used.
Charcoal dropped into liquid oxygen.
Charcoal dropped into liquid oxygen.