Another Navy Wings article...

[CharlieOneSix]

A guy on my Dartmouth entry became a Bucc Observer. They were low flying in The Wash one day and the pilot got a bit too low and hit the mud flats. He didn't make it out but Dave was saved by an uncommanded ejection on impact.
https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/59913

[CharlieOneSix]

Taken from a MOD Navy article:

The Royal Navy will have all new ‘eye in the sky’ uncrewed aerial technology to find and track threats as part of a c£20m contract.
.

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Powerful surveillance sensors from Thales will be fitted to an S-100 uncrewed air system provided by Schiebel and feed real-time images and radar data back to Royal Navy warships on the front line from 2024.

This new flexible and tactical uncrewed air system will be known as ‘Peregrine’ – a name with strong historic links to the Fleet Air Arm.

Alongside the Navy’s Wildcat patrol helicopters, Peregrine will enable round-the-clock surveillance of targets over Gulf waters, and will be available for a spectrum of operational tasks to support allies and partners in the region – including during missions countering pirates, terrorists and smugglers.

Peregrine can be launched in challenging conditions, day and night, and will be deployed to protect warships, greatly extending detection range and fidelity, for enhanced intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance gathering.

Rear Admiral James Parkin, the Royal Navy’s Director Develop, said: “I am delighted that we are at the stage where this excellent capability is about to be introduced into the front line.

“As a system both deployed onto, and integrated into, warships and auxiliaries operating in congested and complex areas of the world, the Peregrine aircraft offers what the Royal Navy needs in order to respond to the wide variety of threats that we are facing today.

“Today is also a key milestone in the Fleet Air Arm's evolution to a mixed crewed and uncrewed fighting arm of the Fleet, and we are anticipating learning many lessons as such technologies continue to develop and offer new opportunities for the current and future Navy.”

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Andy Start, CEO of Defence Equipment & Support who awarded the contract, said: “The DE&S RPAS team have delivered a contract which will see a rapid development and deployment of a key Remotely Piloted Air System capability for the Royal Navy.

Due to the collaborative approach we have taken with industry, the Navy shall be receiving a mature air system which is able to detect threats at range, protecting British interests in the Gulf.”

The air system – which takes off from the ship’s flight deck like a helicopter would – will be the first uncrewed rotary wing aircraft to operate alongside a Wildcat helicopter, allowing for round-the-clock aerial surveillance in a timely boost to the Royal Navy’s operational capability.

The high-definition imagery and radar data from Peregrine will be fed directly into the ship’s Combat Management System, allowing the command team to have good situational awareness and make rapid operational decisions.

Peregrine will be deployed directly into an operational theatre from mid-2024, initially for two years, with the option to extend. This foundation based on operational lessons will give the Royal Navy valuable experience and understanding of the use of uncrewed systems in this role ahead of further decisions and investments through the Future Maritime Aviation Force programme.

The S-100 has rapid launch ability and superior mission endurance of several hours. It will be fitted with the Thales I-Master radar, which will find, track and identify targets using its proven and modern, technology.

The name Peregrine is inspired by the former HMS Peregrine, the Royal Naval Air Station in Ford, West Sussex, that was used after the Second World War as the Fleet Air Arm’s dedicated test and development centre in the early years of carrier-borne jet aircraft.

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Methinks they are going to need a wider skid undercarriage if they hope to safely operate that from Type 45 Destroyers and similar small decks!

[TheGreenAnger]

I suppose this could be a separate thread, but as the FAA and naval aviators tend to post here I placed this here.

I have happened to stumble on this interesting thread started by ricardian viewtopic.php?p=360798#p360798 and was apt to ask a little more about navigation in the FAA back in the 40's. 50's 60's and 70's. I have always been hugely impressed by the skills required to fly away from a moving ship, sometimes hundreds of miles away without the benefit of radio contact or radar control and the ability to be able to navigate back to a base that itself might have moved over a hundred nautical since departure. I know that having a skilled navigator in the back or alongside one might help but what what about the solo pilot having to juggle the task of flying an aircraft (helicopters even more demanding), facing the exigencies of darkness, bad weather, fuel management and possibly enemy action, to navigate and find one's ship is to my meagre mind a somewhat daunting task.

Do any of the pilots or navigators here who flew from carriers and the like have any comments on how this was done so well.

I post a photo of HMS Ark Royal with her large homing beacon obvious on the upper part of the masthead.

[Boac]

Do any of the pilots or navigators here who flew from carriers

Not so qualified but from a fair bit of working with the RN I know the ship would issue an updated 'PIM' before launch. 'Position and Intended movement'. Up to the jock to work it out and hope nothing changes.................

[CharlieOneSix]

I can only comment on the Wessex HAS Mk1 and Mk3. Both had very competent Observers down the back and they were the tacticians in antisubmarine ops. Fortunately we rarely strayed far from the ship as both types had limited range and screening for submarines meant a sortie length was about 90 minutes maximum. The Wessex 1 Observer had nothing but a DR plot whereas in the Mk3 he had a radar plot.

For comms, we initially had old AN/ARC52 UHF radios - from memory these had 20 fixed channels. In 18 you could insert crystal frequencies to match the task, plus 1 for Guard (243MHz) and one other - I forget what that was for. The lighter weight PTR170 UHF radio replaced the AN/ARC52 and this had 12 fixed crystal frequencies including Guard. Both radios were capable of Violet Picture homing. In the cockpit that was basically a left/right needle, nothing else. You had to be cautious and determine whether you were flying towards or away from the transmitter - done by zeroing the needle and turning one way. It soon became obvious whether the transmitter was ahead or behind you.

We also had a SSB HF radio fitted to both Wessex but there were no civvy aids such as VOR/ILS.

This is a cockpit view of a Wessex Mk3. The Violet Picture homer is the far left lowest instrument above three switches. Although it has an azimuth needle this was inoperative in our set up. The similar looking instrument in the middle at far right is the doppler indicator which showed when you were in a hover day or night.

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The problem with the PTR170 in the 60s was that you could not home onto a SARBE beacon on Guard and listen to radar directions from the aircraft carrier at the same time - a point I made forcibly at a Board of Inquiry when we lost a Sea Vixen 40+ miles from the ship and I was tasked with the rescue.

One thing you could be sure of if you had a long distance task - long distance for a helicopter anyway - was that the ship would be nowhere near where she said she would be at your designated Charlie time. One day I was sent to Lossiemouth to pick up half a dozen journalists and take them to Ark Royal - just me up front and an aircrewman/winchman down the back. Ark was around 30 miles from the designated rendezvous. Situation normal!

[TheGreenAnger]

Thanks for that fulsome comment C16.

The Violet Picture homer, without the azimuth sounds, and looks, a little like a VOR without the OBS and the To and From flags. I guess the ship would have had a good idea where you were if they briefly switched their radar on, but I guess under operational circumstances the radio call and the ensuing radar pulses would have been a no-no and very useful to one's enemies although I guess the bulk of an aircraft carrier, and even the intermittent use of the homing beacon would mean that one's enemies would have had a very good idea where the ship was anyway?

@Boac I guess tooling along on in a fast jet on a clear day at altitude (at an altitude that minimized the likelihood of a vapour trail) would have given one a good view for many miles allowing for any discrepancy between ETA or the ships planned course. Not so much in IMC or at night I guess?

PIM eh, as opposed to the Admiral's Pimm's!

[Boac]

Not so much in IMC or at night I guess?

- er, no. I was assuming your query was referring to 'wartime' ops when the ship would not be transmitting any radio freqs. The last resort would be to ask the ship to 'flash' for a few seconds. In 'peacetime' one could talk to the ship/s and be directed by radar or d/f.

Pimms was wot you had on board when the PIM had worked.

[TheGreenAnger]

Not so much in IMC or at night I guess?

- er, no. I was assuming your query was referring to 'wartime' ops when the ship would not be transmitting any radio freqs. The last resort would be to ask the ship to 'flash' for a few seconds. In 'peacetime' one could talk to the ship/s and be directed by radar or d/f.

Pimms was wot you had on board when the PIM had worked.

Which amusing comment had me wondering about the history of gin in the Royal Navy, it being a slow, not Sloe gin, day after all, and I came across this interesting article..

https://thegincooperative.com/in-the-navy/

There are a number of stories relating to how the strength of gin was tested, but many, if not all, involved the use of gunpowder. Up until 1816, there was no method to test the ABV of a spirit, so a test was devised that would provide a good indication of the strength. A few grains of gun powder would be mixed with a small measure of gin from each cask. The solution would then be ignited to see if the gunpowder and liquid would burn. If the gin ignited and created a flame, then this was ‘proof’ that the gin was of a ‘high proof strength’. If the gunpowder failed to ignite, then this was a strong indicator that the gin wasn’t high strength and had most likely been watered down. Bearing in mind that the gin we know today at a minimum 37.5% ABV is a completely different spirit to the gin that would have been served in the officers quarters at high strength.

Testing gin and other spirits using the gunpowder test also meant that if a cask broke in the ship’s hold and the gunpowder stores were flooded, or the gunpowder was damp, in theory, it should still ignite. Faced with battles on the high sea and with the British Empire and Royal Navy’s reputation at stake, the last thing a Captain or crew would want was soggy gunpowder, which would have rendered their cannons useless. Having to explain at a court-martial, you lost one of the King’s royal fleet because you had a problem with ‘soggy gunpowder’ would have seen any officer’s reputation diminished beyond repair.

It was only in 1816 when Bartholomew Sikes invented the alcoholometer that the volume of alcohol in a liquid could be measured. The Royal Navy quickly adopted the alcoholometer; before it was introduced into law in 1818, it was discovered that the minimum ABV required by the Navy was 57.5% ABV. Although after some tests, the Royal Navy discovered the ideal strength for igniting gun powder was 54.5% ABV, and so for the next 150 years, this was the ABV of gin supplied to the Royal Navy. It wasn’t until the 31st of July 1970 that the Royal Navy ceased daily rations of alcohol to crew members, a day that’s known as “Black Tot Day”, which was brought about by The Admiralty Board writing to the House of Commons on the 17th of December 1969.

“The Admiralty Board concludes that the rum issue is no longer compatible with the high standards of efficiency required now that the individual’s tasks in ships are concerned with complex, and often delicate, machinery and systems on the correct functioning of which people’s lives may depend.” In other words, inebriated sailors shouldn’t be operating million-pound naval vessels.

It was only in 1993, 23 years after “Black Tot Day” that the term ‘Navy Strength’ was actually used to brand a gin. For the most part, they were referred to as overproof gin or 100% Proof gin. The term ‘Navy Strength’ is in fact thanks to John Murphy, a marketing consultant who was working with the team at The Plymouth Gin Company. John created the term ‘Navy Strength Gin’ to help market the distillery’s 100% Proof gin. And thus, the modern term for high strength gin was born.

Today, Navy Strength Gins come in all manner of strengths and styles, including cask-aged navy strength gins and old tom navy strength gins. The ideal ABV should be over 57% ABV and there are a number of high strength gins that use the idea of the Navy Strength category to market their high strength gins according to their own story or region, including Highland Strength and Battlefield Strength.

Spoilsports...

[FD2]

Thanks for that TGA. Plymouth is still my favourite though pretty expensive out here - thankfully there are a few good ones available more cheaply.

Back in the 40s and 50s (and probably earlier) the popular drink was a pink gin. A splash of Angostura Bitters was added to the glass before the gin. It was a money saver because tonic water was more expensive than the gin! There were still a few old and bolds who drank it back in the 60s and 70s but for me it tasted foul. When tonic water became more widely available and cheaper, then G&T was the favourite vying for the lead with horse's neck (brandy and ginger ale). I think that by then the spirits were all down to a standard 40% abv.

The stopping of the tot for the lads was a sad day, in losing such an old tradition, but inexcusable (if someone drew his tot then he had to drink it) with the advent of complex weapon systems and equipment. One eighth of a pint of a strong but great tasting blend of rum had to be replaced by a more sensible system. A visit to the chiefs' mess in harbour, a tot of neaters and a glass of CSB laid a few unsuspecting people low!

Nowadays I believe drinking at sea is frowned upon...

[CharlieOneSix]

......A visit to the chiefs' mess in harbour, a tot of neaters and a glass of CSB laid a few unsuspecting people low! ...

I was once invited to the Chief's Mess at Sembawang. I had absolutely no recollection of how I got back to the Wardroom!

Memories of being rum issuing officer on Ark - I think I was high by the end of the session.

In the photo are two of my favourite tipples - a nearly empty bottle of Navy Strength Gin at 57.1% ABV and Gunpowder Proof Pussers Rum at 54.5% ABV. I detest the term British Navy on the rum bottle - ffs it’s the one and only Royal Navy!

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[TheGreenAnger]

Straying slightly from Navy Wings but staying close to the Royal Navy, I read this poem about the wreck of HMS Birkenhead by Francis Hastings Doyle, a poet who I had hitherto not read.

The Loss Of The Birkenhead
Right on our flank the crimson sun went down,
The deep sea rolled around in dark repose,
When, like the wild shriek from some captured town,
A cry of women rose.

The stout ship Birkenhead lay hard and fast,
Caught, without hope, upon a hidden rock;
Her timbers thrilled as nerves, when through them passed
The spirit of that shock.

And ever like base cowards, who leave their ranks
In danger's hour, before the rush of steel,
Drifted away, disorderly, the planks
From underneath her keel.

Confusion spread,for, though the coast seemed near,
Sharks hovered thick along that white sea-brink.
The boats could hold? — not all; and it was clear
She was about to sink.

"Out with those boats, and let us haste away,"
Cried one, "ere yet yon sea the bark devours."
The man thus clamoring was, I scarce need say,
No officer of ours.

We knew our duty better than to care
For such loose babblers, and made no reply,
Till our good colonel gave the word, and there
Formed us in line to die.

There rose no murmur from the ranks, no thought,
By shameful strength, unhonoured life to seek;
Our post to quit we were not trained, nor taught
To trample down the weak.

So we made women with their children go,
The oars ply back again, and yet again;
Whilst, inch by inch, the drawning ship sank low,
Still under steadfast men.

What follows, why recall? The brave who died,
Died without flinching in the bloody surf;
They sleep as well, beneath that purple tide,
As others, under turf; —

They sleep as well, and, roused from their wild grave,
Wearing their wounds like stars, shall rise again,
Joint-heirs with Christ, because they bled to save
His weak ones, not in vain.

If that day's work no clasp or medal mark,
If each proud heart no cross of bronze may press,
Nor cannon thunder loud from Tower and Park,
This feel we, none the less:

That those whom God's high grace there saved from ill —
Those also, left His martyrs in the bay —
Though not by siege, though not in battle, still
Full well had earned their pay.

[Woody]

Keeping the name going

https://www.walkerbayestate.com/birkenheadbrewery

[Rossian]

.....even in the '70s some folk still liked it. One hot summer day a mate pulled into the driveway. "Whatho" sez I, "what can I do for you?"
"I'd like a pink gin" sez 'e, "gin I can do but a bit lacking in the bitters department" sez I.
He went to the boot of his car and lo! he had two cases of bitters. No longer a problem.
He had inherited the captaincy of a supertanker en route to the Gulf as the skipper had a heart attack passing Masirah. Matey had organised the mountain rescue team from RAF Masirah to get him off the ship and get him off to Bahrein.
The Captains steward then told him that as the new man he "owned" the bar and had to buy the stock from the departing skipper. At the stock check he said there was no bloody way he was paying for two cases of bitters, that was more than several peoples lifetimes' worth. It's all or nothing he was told. So that was he came round all his mates in Cornwall asking for a pink gin. God knows how he got home. It was the '70s I suppose.

The Ancient Mariner

[TheGreenAnger]

From Navy Wings.

Had heard of the Caterpillar Club but not the Goldfish Club.

Any folks here a member of this exclusively damp club?

Andy Vanes, who is a dedicated volunteer and friend of Navy Wings and an integral part of the Swordfish team is now officially a member of the Gold Fish Club, having waited for 43 years for recognition after a Wessex helicopter was ditched in the sea off Portland Bill after suffering an engine failure.

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The Goldfish Club originated in 1826 by PB Cow who was a great inventor and innovator of amphibious vehicles, landing craft and buoyancy aids during the Boer War and then went on to acquire a contract in the 2nd WW for gas masks. All members are unified by having ditched in the water from an aircraft during their military career having survived.

https://www.thegoldfishclub.co.uk/histo ... ldfishclub

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Rear Admiral Tony Whetstone was on board the Wessex while the engine failure occurred, he was heard to say to the crew once in a dingy “Well I don’t suppose it will be long before the emergency helicopter arrives to pick us up” only to be told “Sir, we are the emergency helicopter!” Andy was the leading aircrewman and said “the Admiral took it all In his stride, did as he was told and followed his drills”. Sadly Tony passed away at the age of 95 in December 2020 but in his obituary talked about Andy and the ditching of the Wessex.

[CharlieOneSix]

From Navy Wings.

Had heard of the Caterpillar Club but not the Goldfish Club.

Any folks here a member of this exclusively damp club?

FD2 is a Goldfish Club member. viewtopic.php?p=18836#p18836

As a baby pilot straight out of training on my first Squadron I was flying in a Wessex Mk1 with the CO. Sitting in the hover in the Far East on a typical hot calm day at 30ft with the sonar ball in the water we had a runaway down in the rad alt hold channel. "Now when this happens", sez the Boss, "we just let the aircraft descend and the error will wash out and we will return to 30ft". True, that is what happened but both the Observer down the back and I saw the wheels just touch the sea. The Observer jettisoned his window, convinced we were going to ditch. Apparently touching the sea with your wheels doesn't qualify you for Goldfish membership....

[TheGreenAnger]

FD2 is a Goldfish Club member. viewtopic.php?p=18836#p18836

As a baby pilot straight out of training on my first Squadron I was flying in a Wessex Mk1 with the CO. Sitting in the hover in the Far East on a typical hot calm day at 30ft with the sonar ball in the water we had a runaway down in the rad alt hold channel. "Now when this happens", sez the Boss, "we just let the aircraft descend and the error will wash out and we will return to 30ft". True, that is what happened but both the Observer down the back and I saw the wheels just touch the sea. The Observer jettisoned his window convinced we were going to ditch. Apparently touching the sea with your wheels doesn't qualify you for Goldfish membership....

Sounds like the Observer came close to being an inadvertent member of the club all on his own!

[Ex-Ascot]

......A visit to the chiefs' mess in harbour, a tot of neaters and a glass of CSB laid a few unsuspecting people low! ...

I was once invited to the Chief's Mess at Sembawang. I had absolutely no recollection of how I got back to the Wardroom!

Memories of being rum issuing officer on Ark - I think I was high by the end of the session.

In the photo are two of my favourite tipples - a nearly empty bottle of Navy Strength Gin at 57.1% ABV and Gunpowder Proof Pussers Rum at 54.5% ABV. I detest the term British Navy on the rum bottle - ffs it’s the one and only Royal Navy!
IMG_1823.JPG

C16 I agree. It is like here where people ask which Royal Air Force we were in.

[Woody]

Did anyone else see The Antiques Roadshow interview tonight with the Goldfish Club Secretary.

[FD2]

Membership, Social or just Secretary? Members were warned an interview was coming up. https://www.thegoldfishclub.co.uk/the-g ... -committee

[G-CPTN]

Did anyone else see The Antiques Roadshow interview tonight with the Goldfish Club Secretary.

Yes - I saw it.